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 OTCPWAAA |
Aaron Scott |
(OTCP, wrong again and again) SMILE
OTCP, you're right. We don't have documentation on every single item. But over and over and over we read of the Lord healing them ALL.
We don't even usually get that much in a church running 20, let alone when MULTITUDES came to Him and they were ALL healed.
Oh, wait! You think the Gospels are like Heaven's Public Relations Department, or something? Ah, now I understand. They are only telling the good news about Jesus, and "spinning" the numerous failures that also accompanied His ministry, apparently.
No wonder they call it the "good news"--they have left out the bad parts! Why if only the gospels had been more honest, they would have told us that Jesus failed time after time...you know, JUST LIKE US.
Instead, they only tell the success stories. Man, that Jesus is about like a TBN televangelist, isn't He? Reading only the letters of those who were healed or blessed or won the lottery, and conveniently overlooking all the miserable failures.
And here I was thinking you were upset at WOF preachers for making themselves like God. Instead, we should just make Jesus like US!!! |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6042
11/26/13 11:37 am
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| Re: OTCP... |
bradfreeman |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Aaron Scott wrote: | OTCP, you assume that he needed a healing.
Many do NOT assume that, but that it was some other struggle he was dealing with. |
Ummm, I guess "in his flesh" didn't mean in his flesh. That aint assumption. |
2 Cor. 12:9 And He said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for My strength is made perfect in weakness." Therefore most gladly I will rather boast in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
I think it's important to remember, whatever Paul's "thorn" or "messenger of Satan" was, that God didn't hang him out to dry. God abundantly supplied "strength", "grace" and the "power of Christ".
Back to the OP:
So, OTCP, do you have any thoughts on when it's God's will not to heal?
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
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Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
11/26/13 11:43 am
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| Re: OTCPWAAA |
bradfreeman |
| Aaron Scott wrote: | (OTCP, wrong again and again) SMILE
OTCP, you're right. We don't have documentation on every single item. But over and over and over we read of the Lord healing them ALL.
We don't even usually get that much in a church running 20, let alone when MULTITUDES came to Him and they were ALL healed.
Oh, wait! You think the Gospels are like Heaven's Public Relations Department, or something? Ah, now I understand. They are only telling the good news about Jesus, and "spinning" the numerous failures that also accompanied His ministry, apparently.
No wonder they call it the "good news"--they have left out the bad parts! Why if only the gospels had been more honest, they would have told us that Jesus failed time after time...you know, JUST LIKE US.
Instead, they only tell the success stories. Man, that Jesus is about like a TBN televangelist, isn't He? Reading only the letters of those who were healed or blessed or won the lottery, and conveniently overlooking all the miserable failures.
And here I was thinking you were upset at WOF preachers for making themselves like God. Instead, we should just make Jesus like US!!! |
One thing I think that makes the Bible credible to unbelievers is the fact that the Bible speaks frequently about the foibles, sins and character flaws of its characters. No, at least when oppression resulted in the need for "healing", Jesus healed them "all".
Acts 10:38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power, who went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with Him.
Luke 13:16 So ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan has bound--think of it--for eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the Sabbath?"
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
11/26/13 11:47 am
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| Though he slay me |
Patrick Harris |
When it comes to healing you either trust God and his sovereignty or not.
Just because he doesn't heal someone is not a matter of our faith or their faith, it's still a matter of sovereignty on God's part.
If someone, who I had earnestly prayed for died, it still would not affect my believe in Divine Healing because I have seen it time and time again in other ways and other people.
So why doesn't everyone get healed?? I don't know and neither does anyone else for sure.
Faith by its very nature must be tried, and the real trial of faith is not that we find it difficut to trust God, but that God's character has to be cleared in our own minds....
Faith in the Bible is faith in God against everything that contradicts Him - I will remain true to God's character whateverHe may do. "Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him" - Oswald Chambers |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1323
11/26/13 12:14 pm
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Tracy S Hamilton |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Ask Paul why he wasn't healed. It had nothing to do with his faith. |
How do we know that Paul's thorn in his flesh or side was sickness? Could it have been people or those who opposed him for his faith? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo
Posts: 2714
11/26/13 1:24 pm
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| I was not aware Paul's thorn was sickness...... |
caseyleejones |
If you look at the term thorn in the OT, Jehovah said the other nations would be thorns in their sides. It seems to intimate that it had to do with people. When you look at Paul and his dealings with people, he got beat up quite a bit and was opposed from town to town by the pharisees.
Jesus said multiple times "your faith has healed you". Every person who came to Jesus was healed. Jesus was not omniscient because the woman with the issue came and "took" her healing from him.
At the same time, ORU believed God used modern medicine...hence the statue on campus of one hand being God and the other hand being man.
An Indian pastor who pastors several thousand say that 75% of those in their churches came to know Christ because they were miraculously healed. At the same time, they have leper colonies.
Ultimately, do everything you can to get healed whether by man, God, etc....Even the human body exemplifies Gods nature in its self healing properties. |
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11798
11/30/13 6:27 pm
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Old Time Country Preacher |
The ole timer aint gonna do ya research for you fellers, you gonna have to put ya own research skills to use. I'm gonna give ya this foundational an fundamental truth, you boys can research if from air.
In 2013 (really the whole age of grace--from Jesus ministry till he comes again) we live in a state/condition of eschatological tension. Its the called the "already-not yet."
1. We live in a fallen sinful world.
2. Some healins (but most definitely not all, neary is it God's perfect will to heal all in this time of eschatological tension) occur now in our time in this world.
3. In the age to come all will be healed.
4. Was Lazarus (not Lazareth) raised from the dead? Yep, but he later died.
5. Was the woman with he issue a blood an Bart the blind boy healed? Yep, but they both later died.
They will come a time when there will be no sorrow, cryin, death, pain--but that time aint now. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15570
11/30/13 8:21 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
I have always wondered , What if we were healed immediately every time we asked for healing. Would our method of asking slowly turn from a heartfelt request to something like " Ok God Heal me now, I have a ball game to go to"?
Would we soon order healing like we would order a hamburger without thanks to the cook?
Would we soon become arrogant about our power of prayer and believe that it is I/we that have that power to instantly heal through our requests to God and start to take praise ourselves?
Of course some would not , but some would. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
11/30/13 9:15 pm
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bradfreeman |
Some think intense prayer or holy living produce healing. They say we don't see miracles because there's too much sin in the church or not enough prayer. Here's how the NT boys did it:
Acts 3:4 But Peter, along with John, fixed his gaze on him and said, "Look at us!" 5 And he began to give them his attention, expecting to receive something from them. 6 But Peter said, "I do not possess silver and gold, but what I do have I give to you: In the name of Jesus Christ the Nazarene -walk!"
This is effectual fervent prayer. "Walk!" Peter needs to work on his technique. What did Peter have? A long session of intense crying and prayer? No. Faith!
Acts 3:12 But when Peter saw this, he replied to the people, "Men of Israel, why are you amazed at this, or why do you gaze at us, as if by our own power or piety we had made him walk? ... 16 "And on the basis of faith in His name, it is the name of Jesus which has strengthened this man whom you see and know ; and the faith which comes through Him has given him this perfect health in the presence of you all.
Faith, not pious living. We don't earn or pay for something that Jesus already paid for - healing.
Gal. 3:5 So then, does He who provides you with the Spirit and works miracles among you, do it by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? 6 Even so Abraham BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. 7 Therefore, be sure that it is those who are of faith who are sons of Abraham. 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU. 9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with Abraham, the believer.
Paul makes it clear that we don't earn or deserve a miracle, or the Spirit or any of the blessings we get by faith. So, reminding God how Sister Sally has been a faithful servant for 50 years doesn't convince God that she deserves a healing anymore than a crippled sinner laying outside the church doors. Our righteousness (not our sin) is as filthy rags. Never approach God on the basis of your human effort - then our faith in us. Healing comes on the basis of faith in the redemptive work of Christ on the cross - where He bore our sickness and disease - then our faith is in Christ! 2 Peter 2:24
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I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
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Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
12/1/13 8:03 am
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| Who has all the answers? |
Mark Ledbetter |
... but Trophimus I left sick at Miletus.2 Ti 4:20
Trophimus was Paul’s companion during his third missionary journey and indirectly was the reason for Paul’s imprisonment (Acts 20:4; 21:29). When departing Miletus, however, Paul left Trophimus behind because the disciple was sick.
The text describes his sickness as astheneo (ἀσθενέω), an incapacitating weakness.
Using the argument some make, there was no excuse for Paul to leave this man in such condition. If the Apostle had faith, certainly Trophimus could have been healed. If Trophimus had faith, he could have been healed.
I had a very dear friend who contracted aids through a tainted blood transfusion. Prayer meetings met regularly in his home while his body wasted away literally before our eyes. The prayer meetings continued for months but I knew in my heart Tommy was going to die.
During one of the prayer meetings I stopped among the prayers and pleadings for Tommy’s healings when a thought came to me and I shared it with the intercessors: “Unless you are willing to trust Me with your death, you can never trust Me with your life.”
A few weeks later we celebrated Tommy’s homegoing in glorious fashion as we celebrated his life and legacy, but even more so God’s mercy and grace.
On another occasion I was asked to officiate at a funeral of a women I’d never met but her daughter somehow knew of me and asked me to conduct the funeral.
I met with the family at the funeral home and the daughter thanked me for my services and then said, “Brother Ledbetter, I don’t know why mother died. I joined in agreement with several friends but she died anyway. I guess I didn’t have enough faith.”
I became angry because now the woman’s grief was compounded with unnecessary guilt.
Since the Garden we all walk through the valley of the shadow of death and there will come a time when something, somewhere will take us to meet our maker. Then the only faith we will need is if we had trusted Him with our lives and secured eternal life through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.
I witnessed miracles – prayed for women who couldn’t get pregnant and they got pregnant; prayed for a girl with severe curvature of the spine and it straightened like an arrow. Then again I watched some precious people draw their last breath trusting God to heal them.
So, when anyone thinks they have all the answers regarding why God heals some and not others, then we can make him General Overseer.
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Posts: 2109
12/1/13 9:08 am
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DHDRabbi |
1 Timothy 5:23
Be healed in the name of Jesus when you have stomach and frequent illnesses. Nope. Drink wine. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13680
12/1/13 9:46 am
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| I think we're making some assumptions here... |
Clint Wills |
We don't have record saying that anyone who came to Jesus wasn't healed. At the same time, we don't have record of Him healing every single person in the "multitudes" that came to Him. We also don't have record of what happened to Joseph, or what went on the first 30 years of His life. There are a lot of things we don't have record of. What we do know is that not every sick person that Jesus came across was healed. At the pool of Bethesda there would have been many sick people - Jesus healed one.
I think the truth is that He will do whatever He needs to do to further His Kingdom. We say that people are living in the flesh and that's not why they are healed. The truth is more that we are living in the flesh expecting everyone to be healed. God's Kingdom is what is at stake, and it's His first priority. I learned this many years ago watching my sisters promising running career give way to injuries. God didn't give a hoot about her running ability - He cared about her reaching the lost. Somehow, in his infinite wisdom, He knew that she'd have a greater impact on the lives of people by being part of a local church rather than moving away and running in college and possibly the Olympics - yes...she was that good.
Instead, she stayed at home and has lead several people to Christ and is constantly making disciples.
All that is simply to say that we only think we know best when we think God should heal someone. His Kingdom is paramount and that is where our focus needs to be. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5161
12/1/13 10:04 am
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| Clint, you make an interesting point... |
Mark Ledbetter |
| Clint Wills wrote: |
All that is simply to say that we only think we know best when we think God should heal someone. His Kingdom is paramount and that is where our focus needs to be. |
If we examine healing in light of God's purposes and the impact upon His kingdom efforts, we have to step back and ask, "How would this healing (or answer to prayer) impact God's purposes."
We may presume that we know but do we really?
As a teen Joni Eareckson Tada dove into shallow water and an injury to her neck left her a quadriplegic. Joni became an artist using her teeth and became influential in both the Christian and secular communities.
Her faith didn't provide her healing and her condition helped in the proclamation of God's kingdom.
Who is to say her healing would have better served God's purposes?
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Posts: 2109
12/1/13 11:21 am
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| Re: Clint, you make an interesting point... |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Mark Ledbetter wrote: | As a teen Joni Eareckson Tada dove into shallow water and an injury to her neck left her a quadriplegic. Joni became an artist using her teeth and became influential in both the Christian and secular communities.
Her faith didn't provide her healing and her condition helped in the proclamation of God's kingdom.
Who is to say her healing would have better served God's purposes? |
Excellent example there Mark. But Copeland and ilk will say her faith aint adequate an her lack a healin his her own fault. An they is a few folk right here on Acts who thinks Copelands words/teachin is gospel. They is 5 gospels: Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Kenneth. Sad, but true. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15570
12/1/13 2:15 pm
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bradfreeman |
God can clearly work all things together for our good.
But do any of you have any scripture to support your view that God sometimes wants His children sick or diseased? I'm not asking if His children get sick, but when does He WANT them sick? Your examples almost imply that, if they're sick, God wants it that way (a Calvinistic view).
Please address the OP.
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
12/1/13 11:03 pm
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| Brad, |
Mark Ledbetter |
| bradfreeman wrote: | God can clearly work all things together for our good.
But do any of you have any scripture to support your view that God sometimes wants His children sick or diseased? I'm not asking if His children get sick, but when does He WANT them sick? Your examples almost imply that, if they're sick, God wants it that way (a Calvinistic view).
Please address the OP. |
| Quote: | | Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly. For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep. But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged. But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world.1 Co 11:27-32 |
| Quote: |
Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord; and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him. Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.Jas 5:14-16 |
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Posts: 2109
12/1/13 11:39 pm
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| Re: Brad, |
bradfreeman |
| Mark Ledbetter wrote: | | Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner, shall be guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord. But a man must examine himself, and in so doing he is to eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For he who eats and drinks, eats and drinks judgment to himself if he does not judge the body rightly. For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep. But if we judged ourselves rightly, we would not be judged. But when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord so that we will not be condemned along with the world.1 Co 11:27-32 |
Thanks Mark.
So one reason you believe some are "weak and sick, and a number sleep" is because God is judging and disciplining them because they are "guilty of the body and the blood of the Lord" so they won't be "condemned along with the world"?
Some find telling the sick person they aren't healed because they don't have faith for healing distasteful. I would never do that, but simply encourage faith in them.
I wonder if these same folk would find it distasteful to teach or tell the sick that they are to blame for their terminal cancer because of their shortcomings?
BTW, here are a couple of thoughts on this passage as to the meaning of failing to "judge the body rightly". The larger picture is Paul's rebuke of the Corinthians for not waiting for their fellow believers before partaking of the meal. They were rushing in and eating and drinking it all before their brothers and sisters arrived in verses 20-22 leaving some "hungry" and others "drunk".
He had just explained to them in the previous chapter how they are the bread:
1 Cor. 10:17 Since there is one bread, we who are many are one body ; for we all partake of the one bread.
I believe they were failing to discern the "body" meaning that they were all one in Christ. Paul was rebuking them for being selfish and failing to discern that they were all in this together. They were coming in with no concept of their oneness with other believers - no attitude of "where is my brother, I won't eat without him". What was his cure for this behavior and its consequences?
1 Cor. 11:33 So then, my brethren, when you come together to eat, wait for one another. 34 If anyone is hungry, let him eat at home, so that you will not come together for judgment. The remaining matters I will arrange when I come.
Then he goes into more detail about how they are one in 1 Cor. 12 in his teaching on the body.
| Quote: |
Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord; and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him. Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.Jas 5:14-16 |
2 thoughts on this passage:
So another reason you believe some are "sick" is because they have "committed sins" (as though being "guilty of the body and blood of the Lord" wouldn't be a sin)? In this passage, James says "if" he has committed sins. If you quoted this to show the connection between sin and sickness, would this "if" seem to indicate there are situations where sin is not the cause of sickness?
Doesn't the language that the "prayer of faith will restore the one who is sick" indicate that it is always God's will to heal as long as there is a "prayer of faith" regardless of the presence of sin?
This passage doesn't really show that it would not be God's will to heal, does it? In fact, it appears the healing will occur prior to sin being forgiven, and that without any express requirement of confession or repentance.
So, based on these 2 passages:
Should we teach that the "prayer of faith will restore the one who is sick" - if they are not healed it's because a "prayer of faith" was not prayed?
Should we teach that it's not God's will to heal them because the "weak and sick" believers are being judged by God for their guilt or some James 5 "sin"?
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
12/2/13 6:55 am
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| The Prayer of Faith for the Sick |
Mark Ledbetter |
The Prayer of Faith for the Sick
James 5:14-18
James’ epistle is clearing Jewish in orientation and thought and this is very evident in James’ remarks regarding the prayer of faith for the sick.
Sickness and disease are but stern reminders that we continually “walk through the valley of the shadow of death.” James addresses man’s infirmities and a remedy in his closing remarks.
James 5:14-18 reveals important insights into the relationship between sin and sickness and their remedy. With this model before us, we can apply principles James shares and hopefully realize how important it is for the people of God to be faithful and praying community.
Deeply ingrained in Jewish thought is a correlation between sin and sickness.
In Deuteronomy 32:39 we find God to be the source of both life and health, and disease and death. In Deuteronomy 28:58-61 and 29:22 sickness is found to be a form of discipline for rebellion. Sin and sickness is therefore related to guilt and punishment.
Israel’s hope for salvation is twofold:
| Quote: | | A Psalm of David. Bless the Lord, O my soul, And all that is within me, bless His holy name. Bless the Lord, O my soul, And forget none of His benefits; Who pardons all your iniquities, Who heals all your diseases;Ps 103:1-3 |
| Quote: |
He was despised and forsaken of men, A man of sorrows and acquainted with grief; And like one from whom men hide their face He was despised, and we did not esteem Him.Is 53:3 |
This theme is also found in Matthew 9:1-6
| Quote: | | Getting into a boat, Jesus crossed over the sea and came to His own city. And they brought to Him a paralytic lying on a bed. Seeing their faith, Jesus said to the paralytic, “Take courage, son; your sins are forgiven.” And some of the scribes said to themselves, “This fellow blasphemes.” And Jesus knowing their thoughts said, “Why are you thinking evil in your hearts? “Which is easier, to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up, and walk’? “But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—then He said to the paralytic, “Get up, pick up your bed and go home.”Mt 9:1-6 |
And
| Quote: | But the man who was healed did not know who it was, for Jesus had slipped away while there was a crowd in that place. Afterward Jesus found him in the temple and said to him, “Behold, you have become well; do not sin anymore, so that nothing worse happens to you.”Jn 5:13-14
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The disciples believed there was a relationship between the sin of a man or his parents that resulted in his blindness (John 9:1f)
In 1 Corinthians 11:28-31 the Apostle Paul establishes sickness, and even death, as a consequence for abusing the Lord’s Supper. In James 5:15-16, the word for sickness suggests a prolonged struggle which wearies the individual.
James’ Remedy for Sickness and Sin
It is incumbent upon the bedridden, the one who is wearied with their prolonged struggle to call for the Elders. It is not a call as a social obligation to visit the sick, to offer cheer, or aid, but healing. The Elders are to anoint the sick with oil and “pray over the sick” (literally “pray over” the bedridden) in the name of the Lord – Jesus the Messiah.
The prayer is specifically referred to as “the prayer of faith” (or the prayer offered in faith) is vital to the healing process.
Many have sought to define the “prayer of faith,” however James has defined it for us already in James 1:6, “But he must ask in faith without any doubting, for the one who doubts is like the surf of the sea, driven and tossed by the wind.”
The results of the “prayer of faith?”
The sick shall be “saved/restored” and raised from the sick-bed. Eksozo, ἐκσῴζω, can refer to both “save” and “heal/restore to health”
“and if”
The Greek conjunction can be interpreted as “and if” or “even if” and suggests there may be a correlation between sin and sickness.
Regardless, it is possible that healing and forgiveness are in order if “faith” is interjected into the prayer offered for (and by?) the afflicted.
Yet, James’ lesson on healing doesn’t stop at verse 15 but continues in the next verse:
| Quote: |
Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.Jas 5:16 |
Now, Brad asks,
| Quote: | | “This passage doesn't really show that it would not be God's will to heal, does it? In fact, it appears the healing will occur prior to sin being forgiven, and that without any express requirement of confession or repentance.” |
First, while the passage doesn’t suggest that “it would not be God’s will to heal,” the issue might be, as the topic suggests, is there ever a time when it is NOT God’s will to heal? Certainly we believe that God want the best for His children, but because we are limited in knowledge – past, present, and future – it would be presumptuous to impose our will or understanding.
Second, the passage doesn’t suggest that healing comes before forgiveness but forgiveness is part of the solution for any sickness that may be resulting from sin.
Then Brad concludes:
| Quote: | Should we teach that the "prayer of faith will restore the one who is sick" - if they are not healed it's because a "prayer of faith" was not prayed?
Should we teach that it's not God's will to heal them because the "weak and sick" believers are being judged by God for their guilt or some James 5 "sin"? |
First, the “prayer of faith” is essential for any request but, again, we might learn to trust that our affliction may indeed be the instrument that in some way shapes our character and witness. The “prayer of faith” then must give way to our absolute trust/faith in God’s sovereignty and love for His children.
Second, there is nothing to suggest that even though one is afflicted as part of God’s discipline, that there is no remedy for the discipline. Indeed, the severity of not discerning the body of Christ (or my take is in Corinthian context is properly “judging” the body of Christ, therefore He will judge/discipline), results in death as an extreme. Yet, to say God is not willing to forgive and heal as a remedy for their failure would be contrary to God’s nature.
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12/2/13 8:46 am
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| Re: The Prayer of Faith for the Sick |
bradfreeman |
| Mark Ledbetter wrote: | | In Deuteronomy 32:39 we find God to be the source of both life and health, and disease and death. In Deuteronomy 28:58-61 and 29:22 sickness is found to be a form of discipline for rebellion. Sin and sickness is therefore related to guilt and punishment. |
Gal. 3:11 Now that no one is justified by the Law before God is evident ; for, "THE RIGHTEOUS MAN SHALL LIVE BY FAITH." 12 However, the Law is not of faith ; on the contrary, "HE WHO PRACTICES THEM SHALL LIVE BY THEM." 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us-for it is written, "CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO HANGS ON A TREE "- 14 in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
Mark, if righteousness, blessing and freedom from the Deut. 28 curses comes by faith and not by living a sinless life, wouldn't the view that God employs Deut. 28 curses to discipline the sin of His children be contrary to Galatians 3:13?
Do you find it more palatable to explain to the sick that they remain sick because (1) no one has yet prayed a prayer of faith (in the case of the innocently ill) or (2) the sin causing the sickness is not forgiven or confessed?
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Last edited by bradfreeman on 12/2/13 2:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
12/2/13 9:31 am
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| Re: The Prayer of Faith for the Sick |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| bradfreeman wrote: |
Do you find it more palatable to explain to the sick that they remain sick because (1) no one has yet prayed a prayer of faith (in the case of the innocently ill) or (2) the sin causing the sickness is not forgiven or confessed? |
Its a heap more palatable (whatever at means) to tell folk the truth for they ever git sick. That bein, a steady diet a truth. That God don't always heal in this life. But in the life to come, son you talk about shoutin................. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15570
12/2/13 11:28 am
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