Actscelerate.com Forum Index Actscelerate.com
Open Any Time -- Day or Night
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
r/Actscelerate
Browse by what's: hot | new | rising | top of the week

The church is the worst place for the victim to go for comfort/justice in child abuse

 
   Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Message Author
Post The church is the worst place for the victim to go for comfort/justice in child abuse Cojak
In the below article Rachel Denhollander states she lost a lot in her coming forth to accuse Larry Nassar, the Olympics team Doctor of abuse. She lost her church.

Looking at many church related abuse charges, some highlighted here on Acts, she could be right. Of course from her stand point she is.

What do you think?


https://www.aol.com/article/news/2018/02/02/rachael-denhollander-nassar-church-worst-places-to-go-for-help/23351688/
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24285
2/2/18 11:03 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Carolyn Smith
I agree with what she said, but there is a reason of sorts. Evil men & women have used this as a ploy to destroy ministers, and since we believe in "innocent until proven guilty," the church has overreacted and are afraid to bring in law enforcement.

Physical, verbal, and emotional abuse are also swept under the rug and people are told to "pray about it."

If sexual abuse is reported to the church, and there is a shred of evidence it is true, it should be reported to law enforcement. I think pastors are required to report it. It should not be handled by the church.

It is a tough line to call, though, whether someone is trying to cause trouble or whether it's true. And by the time it's discovered to be untrue, a minister's reputation and a church are destroyed.

Sexual abuse victims outside the church need to go to a qualified counselor. Most pastors (and wives) are not equipped to offer the kind/depth of support needed. But it should not be ignored, either.
_________________
"More of Him...less of me."
http://twitter.com/camiracle77
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5923
2/3/18 11:08 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Cojak
Carolyn Smith wrote:
I agree with what she said, but there is a reason of sorts. Evil men & women have used this as a ploy to destroy ministers, and since we believe in "innocent until proven guilty," the church has overreacted and are afraid to bring in law enforcement.

Physical, verbal, and emotional abuse are also swept under the rug and people are told to "pray about it."

If sexual abuse is reported to the church, and there is a shred of evidence it is true, it should be reported to law enforcement. I think pastors are required to report it. It should not be handled by the church.

It is a tough line to call, though, whether someone is trying to cause trouble or whether it's true. And by the time it's discovered to be untrue, a minister's reputation and a church are destroyed.

Sexual abuse victims outside the church need to go to a qualified counselor. Most pastors (and wives) are not equipped to offer the kind/depth of support needed. But it should not be ignored, either.


Good logic and comment, Thumb Up

The church in THIS DAY especially, is facing very tough decisions!!!!

People NEED answers. Yes Christ is the Answer for one's soul! Cool
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24285
2/3/18 11:59 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
—.

Last edited by SouthFloridaman on 3/26/18 10:11 pm; edited 2 times in total
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/4/18 3:43 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
..—-

Last edited by SouthFloridaman on 3/26/18 10:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/4/18 4:12 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post On another note BishopsWife
Would you report a convicted minister (registered as a sex offender) who is being used as a minister in the pulpit to your Admin. Bishop? Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1814
2/8/18 10:15 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: On another note Nature Boy Florida
BishopsWife wrote:
Would you report a convicted minister (registered as a sex offender) who is being used as a minister in the pulpit to your Admin. Bishop?


Yes.

I know of some in North Florida that were no longer used - once they had the predator tag affixed to their face online. I don't know of them being used to minister after that - or if they were (by law) even allowed into the church without an escort.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today!
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16646
2/8/18 10:25 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: On another note SouthFloridaman
BishopsWife wrote:
Would you report a convicted minister (registered as a sex offender) who is being used as a minister in the pulpit to your Admin. Bishop?


I think a background check for any licensed minister on a 1 to 2 yr basis should be standard for any denomination that provides license. I don’t feel that the one background check at the beginning of licensing is sufficient. A serious conviction could slip under the radar after licensing. An annual or biennial background check would help minimize those rare cases that do. Imagine if a pastor had domestic abuse, drug charges, DUI or something more serious. I feel that we should be on alert because sometimes people will not be honest. I know of churches where an annual background check is mandatory for all elders and volunteers that work with minors. Why not for licensed ministers. I know of non licensed ministers of independent churches who attend COG camp meetings and ministerial training events that know full well they can’t be licensed and don’t pursue license but still want to be involved it worries me. A new overseers comes and doesn’t know the whole story and thinks hey I could bring that independent pastor and their church into the denomination they don’t know the whole story as to why they aren’t in fellowship. We need to be vigilant.
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/20/18 11:46 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
—.

Last edited by SouthFloridaman on 3/26/18 10:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/21/18 12:14 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Cojak
SouthFloridaman wrote:
In my opinion .... What if who you alert doesn’t want or even worse is not allowed by superiors to follow up or investigate? It could happen that why policys and procedures need to be established on local and nation level at any organization.


This is our biggest problem. 'Protect' our church and reputation. Handle it in-house.
That may have worked in years past, but the victim 'remained' a victim years later. That was/is sad. Crying or Very sad
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24285
2/21/18 11:16 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
Cojak wrote:
SouthFloridaman wrote:
In my opinion .... What if who you alert doesn’t want or even worse is not allowed by superiors to follow up or investigate? It could happen that why policys and procedures need to be established on local and nation level at any organization.


This is our biggest problem. 'Protect' our church and reputation. Handle it in-house.
That may have worked in years past, but the victim 'remained' a victim years later. That was/is sad. Crying or Very sad



What is our course of action Cojak? In my opinion We have minutes and bylaws for everything but no clarity for this. Executive committee needs to address this or this issue needs to be brought up at general assembly by our bishops. Denominations need A course of action for members and pastors to properly address issues involving minors instead of hiding behind the ecclesiastical curtain of it won’t became a court issue until later when they are gone and passing it off to the next pastor state bishop or office holder. I remember a few years back there was a case that was settled out of court in south Florida that involved a lead pastor and his son in law that worked at the same church. I believe the families involved spoke out but we’re treated to my understanding like the problem. I am not sure but I think the first victim was not believed until second came forward. I wonder if this was handled differently what would have been the outcome. Instead we have denominations all across America financially and morally crippled because of a lack of training and knowledge on how to proceed in a Godly and legal manner.
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/21/18 4:31 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Cojak
If I am not mistaken we are breaking the law if we do not report such actions at present. Of course some would argue it is hear-say and the pastor/leader gives credence to the leader. But I think those arguments are mute with the present laws. I understand that 'any' accusations of 'molestation' must be reported.

Maybe someone can clarify that, in reference to church.

I know the Catholic has and is having MUCH problems for lack of past actions.
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24285
2/21/18 5:05 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
Cojak wrote:
If I am not mistaken we are breaking the law if we do not report such actions at present. Of course some would argue it is hear-say and the pastor/leader gives credence to the leader. But I think those arguments are mute with the present laws. I understand that 'any' accusations of 'molestation' must be reported.

Maybe someone can clarify that, in reference to church.

I know the Catholic has and is having MUCH problems for lack of past actions.


Correct reporting is required. It is that moment after reporting and the law being involve that is concerning what I call judicial purgatory. The time where people are finally realizing what has happened. With cases involving minors there is no statue of limitations so the waiting til someone press charges can take years even decades sometimes victims don’t pursue charges out of embarrassment or trauma. Just think of the the parkland school shooter many came forward sounding the alarm the police visited the shooter and still the ball was still dropped the unthinkable happened. I wonder how much political correctness played a factor in that. The church can’t afford to have the same happen. We have to have procedures. Plus with some experiences. I have heard of perps and their family who are so mentally deranged as to keep attending the churches where the abuse happened even after being caught. Sometimes under the guise of being Delusional or mentally ill enough to believe that nothing happened. Many good church attendees flee the church upon discovery of what happened. I know of a church my friend grew up in had hundreds of members and Predator got in the nursery who was also the church secretary’s husband. The court was backwards enough to try and make 3 and 4 year olds go to the stand. One parent just dropped charges because of her daughter’s nightmares. The pastor left the church and no one went to that church as pastor for months. The church went from 600 down to 100. The perp stayed in the church and pretended nothing was wrong or happened. Delusion people in the church even went as far to say we can’t kick him out of the church. God forgives why shouldn’t we forgive him. Forgive yes but being foolish to not do something about it come on. These sickos choose their victims they Choose the most innocent to hurt those who can’t speak up or defend themselves. Young children or the handicapped. This is a REAL problem.


Last edited by SouthFloridaman on 2/21/18 10:09 pm; edited 4 times in total
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/21/18 5:49 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Cojak
SouthFloridaman wrote:
.... This is a REAL problem.


You are absolutely correct!
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24285
2/21/18 9:13 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
Cojak wrote:
SouthFloridaman wrote:
.... This is a REAL problem.


You are absolutely correct!


Thanks cojak
Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/22/18 6:48 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post SouthFloridaman
Without any doubt yes it is the absolute worse place to go. Fixing it is gonna take JESUS coming back Friendly Face
Posts: 358
2/26/18 5:11 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Acts-celerate Terms of Use | Acts-celerate Policy
Contact the Administrator.


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group :: Spelling by SpellingCow.