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diakoneo

Pastors, don't you just love it when folks call the church and tell you...

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/22/16 12:09 pm**

that it is the churches responsibility to pay their water bill?

Especially when they claim to "know" the bible and can talk some religious stuff.

I was having an incredible prayer time with the Lord and the phone kept ringing and ringing. I just kept praying and praying. When I got through I went in office and phone rang again and it was someone telling me their water was going to be turned off if someone didn't come up with $100 dollars for them. He and a whole band of his family had moved from Missouri (roughrider you might know these folks Wink

). Most of them were drawing some kind (or in the middle of trying to receive) of disability. They were living in 5 trailers in a trailer park. Paying a over $1600 dollars rent for all five trailers, yet they could not come up with $25 dollars a piece to pay for one of their water bills. But the church can and should pay all of it. At least that was his attitude.

He explained that he watched The Left Behind series all the time and that many churches were going to be left behind because they didn't help people. That we (church) were there to help poor people. I explained to him that the only clear mandate to help, we have was to help "widows and orphans" I don't think he liked that. Smile

Da Sheik

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1865 **4/22/16 12:20 pm**

We field those calls on a monthly basis. And it's almost always the same scenario....the water/power/heat is going to be cut off today usually within a few hours. The former pastor here was a lot more generous than I am, but the church has a benevolence fund and gives the pastor discretion within reason to help individuals on a case-by-case basis.

The former pastor also kept meticulous records (for which I am truly thankful!!!) of anyone who has ever received assistance from the church and the exact amounts and scenarios. It never fails that the majority of phone calls we receive are repeat offenders.

You can almost always tell whether there is a legitimate need. When the person becomes defensive, aggressive, or passive aggressive and accusatory then my radar goes up. On the other hand, it's always a wonderful feeling when you can meet a need and see genuine thankfulness on the other end.

diakoneo

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/22/16 1:02 pm**

4thgeneration

A few thoughts

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1607 **4/22/16 1:15 pm**

1- If you're the pastor, don't strap yourself with the burden of handling the benevolence calls and decisions. I haven't for over 20 years. That allows me to say to people who show up right about time we dismiss wanting help that they will have to call the church office and speak to the person who handles benevolence. I never promise help, but always let them know that funds are always limited, and there are a lot of people who look for help, so sometimes the answer is no. Find someone else, or form a committee and let them deal with that aspect of ministry. It isn't biblical for the pastor to do so.

2- Set pre-determined limitations on who you help, for what, how much, and how often. There are those who habitually make the rounds every month to find someone to pay something for them. Good records allow you to see those for who they are and wean them off of looking to your church constantly for help.

3- Attitude is everything. A person who speaks like the guy you described sets himself up for an automatic no. In spite of what he says, it isn't the church's responsibility to support people who won't learn to live within their means. Emergency situations, unexpected needs that take them beyond their means, and other occasional needs are legit. But living off the benevolence of churches month after month is not.

4- God will direct if we listen. Today I had someone walk up to me at the gas station asking for 2-3 dollars for enough gas to get home. Something inside said do it, so I did. They pulled around and got $3.76 in gas and left. No matter the story, if God doesn't say yes, its a no from me. And if God says yes, then I help.

5- This fits in the "these kind you always have with you" category of a never ending stream of people with their hands out. I'm convinced that if someone gave a church a million dollars to give out in benevolence, the line would be longer when it was all gone than when you started. So setting in place procedures, limits. and specific people to handle it (other than the pastor) will help navigate this never ending stream of those wanting money.

There are legitimate needs, and there are also people that are very good at working the system. Only God can help us navigate the waters of discerning and doing the right thing.

Just my O!

c6thplayer1

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6385 **4/22/16 1:19 pm**

I really like to deal with this type of person. I enjoy making up excuses why we cant help them that is more ridiculous than the the story they gave us. Laughing

Sometimes for the established moochers we just tell them that we are only equipped to help with food. Two large cans of soup for a family and one can for an Individual.

Da Sheik

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1865 **4/22/16 1:57 pm**

My secretary does an excellent job of filtering these requests for me. If something makes it to my desk, it's because she has vetted them initially. We do a food pantry and clothing as our major outreach. People abuse those too, but I feel better giving someone food for their stomach instead of just writing a check.

4th Gen gave some good pointers. I can't always steer clear of fielding benevolence requests as a pastor, but I agree there needs to be someone else charged with the task on a regular basis. And as he said, Sunday mornings are not the time to handle that stuff.

Nature Boy Florida

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16646 **4/22/16 2:09 pm**

I was thirsty and you gave me to drink.
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today!

brotherjames

Here's some advice

Acts-celerater Posts: 935 **4/22/16 9:48 pm**

We have a food pantry and we are connected with 2 harvest and give food out once a week to the community and whenever needed to our congregation. However we put together a list of the local agencies that offer help to the needy. We offer to give people the list, in addition the churches in our city banded together a number of years ago and developed an agency that functions like the salvation army to this community. It is funded primarily by the local churches but has grown beyond us and now raises it's own funds also and gets support from local businesses as well. No church in town will give out money. We tell people who call that all our benevolence money is given to this agency. We direct them to them as they are set up to screen out the scam artists etc. When the people say they have already gone there we reply well we can't do any more. If your town doesn't gave such a thing and most don't get your churches to support the salvation army monthly and direct peoplebthere. Don't help people from outside your church with any money. Just food if you are so inclined. If all the churches in your town adopted that practice it would severely cut down on the scammed and would help the truly needy. Just a thought.

Old Time Country Preacher

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 15570 **4/22/16 10:03 pm**

Mark Ledbetter

In most cases

Golf Cart Mafia Associate Posts: 2109 **4/23/16 12:41 pm**

individuals saying they are in danger of having utilities turned off are not providing the full picture.

One, they received a bill.

Two, they didn't pay the bill and a second bill is issued with the old and current bill posted.

Three, they receive a notice they have 10 or 15 days before services are cancelled.

In other words, they have had up to 45 days to come up with the money for the original bill.

So, the question to be asked is: Why did you wait to the last minute to try to pay the bill that was due 45 days ago?
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diakoneo

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/23/16 4:42 pm**

c6thplayer1

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6385 **4/23/16 6:25 pm**

We have been scammed to many times.

diakoneo

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/24/16 9:26 am**

I am glad I don't insulate myself from all of this stuff.

It is one thing to hear what many in the world think the churches duty is, but quite another to hear it straight from the "horses mouth".

I understand why sometimes it is necessary, but I think occasionally we (pastors) should take those calls.

Bullseye77

Warning

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1441 **4/24/16 9:35 am**

I pastored two churches located on main thoroughfares through my state. People were always stopping by and asking for assistance. I think I've heard all the stories. Most of them, at least. I used to let them work for the church for some amount of money. Yard work mostly. That was then. Way back then. If I were to do that now, and one of them would get hurt, I would be responsible for them. I could get sued and they'd live happily ever after. Letting them work for you is a "no-no."
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On Target!!

c6thplayer1

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6385 **4/24/16 1:45 pm**

Quiet Wyatt

[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12817 **4/24/16 2:21 pm**

One county I previously pastored in had a great interdenominational organization called "Love, INC. (In the Name of Christ)" which any church could voluntarily affiliate with and support if they wanted to. Any church could then just refer anyone in need to Love INC, and the organization would provide groceries and in some cases help with utilities. It pretty much totally eliminated the common problem of folks just making the rounds from church to church. I really wish we had something like that here.

Ed Brewer

...takes the cake

Friendly Face Posts: 312 **4/24/16 3:58 pm**

Had a deaf girl come to the parsonage asking for cat litter for her cat - acted surprised when I told her we didn't do that - didn't want food or anything for herself - just poo powder for the puss -- had to pray thru on that one.
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diakoneo

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/24/16 10:38 pm**

diakoneo

Re: ...takes the cake

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3382 **4/24/16 10:42 pm**

Link

Acts-perienced Poster Posts: 11849 **4/24/16 10:46 pm**

This reminds me when I was a poor college student or right out of college and beggars downtown would try to beg money off of me. I'd helped some people before a little, but I didn't like being lied to.

One time this guy told me he'd run out of gas and wanted a few dollars for gas. I asked him if was that car over on Clarke Street with the hazard lights flashing. He said, yeah, that's it. I said, that's funny. I was just on Clarke Street and I didn't see any car with it's hazard lights on. I think he said, "Oh man, that's not cool."
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