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 Oil and gas, the false prop for the economy for 15 years |
UncleJD |
| is gone. Now there's nothing to artificially hold the economy up at all. I live in Texas and will be crucified for saying this, but the truth is, and they all know it, oil and gas should have NEVER been as high as it was. That was a false market created by purposeful reduction in output by OPEC to push oil over $100 a barrel. I'm not even an investor and I knew that would eventually come crashing down the other direction but we went on acting as if it would never change. Now people are left without jobs because of it. When oil went through the roof, our general economy sank because people's disposable (spendable) income went into the tank (literally). Subsequently, in a normal, healthy economy, when the reverse happens, the economy should improve with more people able to spend more money in more industries (rising water lifting every boat). If that's not happening (and I don't think it is), then you have an economy that was too closely tied to a single industry. I'm sad for those families hurt by this, I'm even more sad for an economy that doesn't seem to be reaping the benefit. I hope that turns around soon. Affordable gasoline has always been a boon to free countries and a burden to oppressive ones. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/10/16 2:56 pm
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UncleJD |
| There is a way to fix this, curb import of foreign oil, let domestic prices rise a bit so that we continue our own development and lessen our dependence on foreign oil completely. Not sure anyone in DC wants to see that happen though. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/10/16 3:00 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
I have no pity on them , they have raped us for years , now let the oil exec's take a hit and I hope its a big one.
| Quote: | | Oil: Exxon Chairman's $400 Million Parachute |
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/PainAtThePump/story?id=1841989 |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
2/10/16 10:15 pm
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Cojak |
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UncleJD |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | I have no pity on them , they have raped us for years , now let the oil exec's take a hit and I hope its a big one.
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My pity is for the many thousands of American families left without work because of the slump, I have none for the execs either (and they don't need any).
In the long run, the Saudis have done this so that the American threat to their future sales will be destroyed. That is bad for all of us. I'm generally against protectionism, but if well timed it could be a good thing to protect us from dependence on oppressive regimes. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/10/16 10:59 pm
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Quiet Wyatt |
I don't think oil and gas is/was a false prop for the economy. The most important industry in the area where I pastor is oil and gas. It has definitely not been a false prop here. The reason the industry has been hemorrhaging jobs for the past year and a half is almost completely because of what Saudi Arabia is doing. I will say that the falsehood many bought into is the idea that the boom couldn't possibly bust. The Saudis did the exact same thing in the early 1980s, and it had a devastating effect on the oil and gas industry then, just as their flooding the market with their cheap and easily accesible oil reserves is doing now.
Last edited by Quiet Wyatt on 2/11/16 10:07 am; edited 2 times in total |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12817
2/11/16 1:06 am
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Resident Skeptic |
| Quiet Wyatt wrote: | | I don't think lol and gas is/was a false prop for the economy. The most important industry in the area where I pastor is oil and gas. It has definitely not been a false prop here. The reason the industry has been hemorraging jobs for the past year and a half is almost completely because of what Saudi Arabia is doing. I will say that the falsehood many bought into is the idea that the boom couldn't possibly bust. The Saudis did the exact same thing in the early 1980s, and it had a devastating effect on the oil and gas industry then, just as their flooding the market with their cheap and easily accesible oil reserves is doing now. |
All designed to put American companies out of business. Then the price will surge again.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
2/11/16 8:29 am
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UncleJD |
| Quiet Wyatt wrote: | | I don't think lol and gas is/was a false prop for the economy. The most important industry in the area where I pastor is oil and gas. It has definitely not been a false prop here. The reason the industry has been hemorraging jobs for the past year and a half is almost completely because of what Saudi Arabia is doing. I will say that the falsehood many bought into is the idea that the boom couldn't possibly bust. The Saudis did the exact same thing in the early 1980s, and it had a devastating effect on the oil and gas industry then, just as their flooding the market with their cheap and easily accesible oil reserves is doing now. |
Don't misunderstand me, its an important industry, but an economy that has been doing well solely because of one industry is not a strong economy and if that one industry has been propped up because of high prices brought about artificially as it has been since the Saudis and OPEC decided to drive the prices high. Then it is an artificial prop to the economy. That is not saying its not important, trust me no state benefits from oil and gas more than mine. That's precisely why I think that now would be a good time to prop the industry up domestically for a while until we no longer over react from price controls from OPEC
I don't favor protectionism in general, I believe in free-markets. But when a market is controlled by a cartel of oppressive regimes, then it should be considered as self defense. America has the shale-oil and gas reserves to put OPEC out of business and they know it, that is why they are willing to sacrifice for the short term to put us out of business. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/11/16 9:17 am
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diakoneo |
| If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. Ant the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
2/11/16 9:41 am
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UncleJD |
| diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. Ant the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/11/16 9:45 am
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diakoneo |
Y | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. And the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
When money is around, everybody in D.C. Will want some.
I am thinking environmentalist groups in particular, but I am certain there are others. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
2/11/16 10:01 am
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UncleJD |
| diakoneo wrote: | Y | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. And the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
When money is around, everybody in D.C. Will want some.
I am thinking environmentalist groups in particular, but I am certain there are others. |
Yeah, I know and its why I don't like the idea of protectionism, but I think its called for in this case to protect our future here. But hopefully a conservative would be in charge and that money would be put back into the exploration of our shale-oil |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/11/16 10:03 am
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diakoneo |
| UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | Y | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. And the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
When money is around, everybody in D.C. Will want some.
I am thinking environmentalist groups in particular, but I am certain there are others. |
Yeah, I know and its why I don't like the idea of protectionism, but I think its called for in this case to protect our future here. But hopefully a conservative would be in charge and that money would be put back into the exploration of our shale-oil |
If tarriffs are introduced, it will push the price of domestic higher. They will get more money and higher profits on the oil. Don't see why we would need to put any money in exploration. National debt, to me is better. With the caveat of Balanced Budget amendment. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
2/11/16 10:09 am
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UncleJD |
| diakoneo wrote: | | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | Y | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. And the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
When money is around, everybody in D.C. Will want some.
I am thinking environmentalist groups in particular, but I am certain there are others. |
Yeah, I know and its why I don't like the idea of protectionism, but I think its called for in this case to protect our future here. But hopefully a conservative would be in charge and that money would be put back into the exploration of our shale-oil |
If tarriffs are introduced, it will push the price of domestic higher. They will get more money and higher profits on the oil. Don't see why we would need to put any money in exploration. National debt, to me is better. With the caveat of Balanced Budget amendment. |
Maybe, that would be ok. Putting it in a general fund (debt payment), may be the same thing as a green light to spend more money though. I think putting it back into the industry you are protecting would be a way to increase the speed at which it worked. But as long as something got done to stop OPEC's strangle-hold on us. We were "that close" to becoming independent and they know it, that's why they're doing this. They don't even care if their own people suffer (they have billions in the bank who cares if the minions starve). |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
2/11/16 10:14 am
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diakoneo |
| UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | Y | UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: | | If we are going to prop something up, how are we going to pay for it, without taxes/tarriffs? I think a tarriff should be levied against OPEC producers until they get in line. And the money raised should go straight to the national debt. |
That is exactly how. |
When money is around, everybody in D.C. Will want some.
I am thinking environmentalist groups in particular, but I am certain there are others. |
Yeah, I know and its why I don't like the idea of protectionism, but I think its called for in this case to protect our future here. But hopefully a conservative would be in charge and that money would be put back into the exploration of our shale-oil |
If tarriffs are introduced, it will push the price of domestic higher. They will get more money and higher profits on the oil. Don't see why we would need to put any money in exploration. National debt, to me is better. With the caveat of Balanced Budget amendment. |
Maybe, that would be ok. Putting it in a general fund (debt payment), may be the same thing as a green light to spend more money though. I think putting it back into the industry you are protecting would be a way to increase the speed at which it worked. But as long as something got done to stop OPEC's strangle-hold on us. We were "that close" to becoming independent and they know it, that's why they're doing this. They don't even care if their own people suffer (they have billions in the bank who cares if the minions starve). |
Agreed!
I have a pretty good email rapport  with my senators and representative. Gonna drop them a line. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
2/11/16 10:18 am
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c6thplayer1 |
| Wonder what oil speculators kickback equates to? |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
2/11/16 10:54 am
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