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 Donald Trump Stands by Barring Muslims Despite Bipartisan Criticism |
c6thplayer1 |
| I wont criticize donald , I'm behind him 100% on this issue. muslims are killing and torturing christians all over the world. why would I care what they think about us banning them in the US. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 10:54 am
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Dave Dorsey |
| Do you also agree with him that the ban should include Muslims who are American citizens? |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
12/8/15 11:04 am
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UncleJD |
while I understand the tide of anti-PC backlash and enjoy it myself. I will answer you question with one word .. precedent
Our laws are based as much on precedent as they are on written words, so if a President were able to do some of the things Trump proposes to Muslims, then what will the next Obama that is elected feel like he can do to Christians that he or she wants to classify as "dangerous".
More screening? Yes.
Fix the broken visa system? Yes.
Temporarily hold off on any further refugees? Yes.
Ban ALL Muslims from entry into the US? No
Track American Muslims in the US and monitor ALL mosques ? No
Encourage a system of citizen spying and reporting on Muslims? Not without clear criteria, think about Nazi Germany
Now, I'm not saying the Trump has said all of these things, but it sounds like he has. IF he's only saying lets temporarily hold off until we know how these people got through the system and were completely off the FBI's radar? Then Yes I agree with that. One of Trump's problems is that he's not a very clear communicator. He speaks in ambiguous terms (to say the least). |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/8/15 11:05 am
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Dave Dorsey |
The question of what we do with people who aren't American citizens is a different issue. I agree with UncleJD; Trumps's plan is idiotic, unhelpful, and would set an awful precedent. But in terms of legality, the Supreme Court has ruled that unadmitted and nonresident aliens have no Constitutional right to entry (Kleindienst v. Mandel). Don't get me wrong, I think it's an idiotic idea, but it's not illegal to arbitrarily ban unadmitted and nonresident aliens from the United States, even in a way that is not equally protective.
But... people who advocate extending this "policy" to American citizens are nothing but tyrannical fascists. There is zero difference between them and the most liberal leftwing gun grabber, who wants to deny American citizens of their rights to bear arms because he can. There is zero difference between them and the tyrants who caused millions to die throughout the 20th century. They have no understanding of liberty, due process, or Constitutional rights and are worth no further attention, except as is required to illuminate their fascist thoughts for what they are. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
12/8/15 11:12 am
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Nature Boy Florida |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | The question of what we do with people who aren't American citizens is a different issue. I agree with UncleJD; Trumps's plan is idiotic, unhelpful, and would set an awful precedent. But in terms of legality, the Supreme Court has ruled that unadmitted and nonresident aliens have no Constitutional right to entry (Kleindienst v. Mandel). Don't get me wrong, I think it's an idiotic idea, but it's not illegal to arbitrarily ban unadmitted and nonresident aliens from the United States, even in a way that is not equally protective.
But... people who advocate extending this "policy" to American citizens are nothing but tyrannical fascists. There is zero difference between them and the most liberal leftwing gun grabber, who wants to deny American citizens of their rights to bear arms because he can. There is zero difference between them and the tyrants who caused millions to die throughout the 20th century. They have no understanding of liberty, due process, or Constitutional rights and are worth no further attention, except as is required to illuminate their fascist thoughts for what they are. |
Where did Trump say he would ban Muslim American citizens. I missed that.
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16630
12/8/15 11:59 am
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Dave Dorsey |
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c6thplayer1 |
| Quote: | | Where did Trump say he would ban Muslim American citizens. I missed that. |
You missed it because he didnt say that.
You cannot ban an American Citizen for religious reasons however those that are muslims should be monitored closely.
If you are coming to this country and are a muslim then YES by all means BAN them All until this problem comes under control.
All of this hypothetical garbage of what will happen to christians if this is allowed is just that , garbage.
If the christians start doing this jihad garbage then they should be monitored to.
muslims are not your friend.
Last edited by c6thplayer1 on 12/8/15 12:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 12:23 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
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c6thplayer1 |
My mistake , Then I agree with him. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 12:26 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | | My mistake , Then I agree with him. |
...but you just got done saying "You cannot ban an American Citizen for religious reasons" three minutes ago. What changed? |
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Posts: 13654
12/8/15 12:26 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | | c6thplayer1 wrote: | | My mistake , Then I agree with him. |
...but you just got done saying "You cannot ban an American Citizen for religious reasons" three minutes ago. What changed? |
I made the mistake of assuming that if an American Citizen was abroad and came back to the US our laws would prohibit them from being banned for religious reasons.
However if we had a leader that could initiate this procedure explicitly for muslims then I would be for it 100%. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 12:34 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | | I made the mistake of assuming that if an American Citizen was abroad and came back to the US our laws would prohibit them from being banned for religious reasons. |
Uh... no, you didn't make a mistake with that assumption. American citizens do enjoy this quaint thing called freedom of religion.
| Quote: | | However if we had a leader that could initiate this procedure explicitly for muslims then I would be for it 100%. |
If Constitutional rights don't apply to all American citizens, they don't apply to any of them. Rights aren't inalienable to you -- they aren't a recognition of nature's law, they're simply privileges that are enjoyed as a result of your good grace and can be taken away at a whim. You are indistinguishable from any other garden-variety liberal fascist.
Last edited by Dave Dorsey on 12/8/15 12:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Posts: 13654
12/8/15 12:36 pm
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UncleJD |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: |
All of this hypothetical garbage of what will happen to christians if this is allowed is just that , garbage. |
No, its not "garbage", its what every liberty loving Christian conservative in America has discussed for the last 70 years. I highly doubt a regular poster on this forum such as yourself has NEVER posted about the possibility of the government coming after Christians for their views. (think about wedding cakes just as one small example if you need help remembering) |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/8/15 12:40 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| UncleJD wrote: | | No, its not "garbage", its what every liberty loving Christian conservative in America has discussed for the last 70 years. I highly doubt a regular poster on this forum such as yourself has NEVER posted about the possibility of the government coming after Christians for their views. |
Fascists never consider the long-term consequences of their views; only their immediate goals. They are short-sighted and cannot see that if the rule of law is compromised so they can punish or destroy their enemies, it will not be there later when they are the ones in need of its protections.
Last edited by Dave Dorsey on 12/8/15 12:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Posts: 13654
12/8/15 12:42 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | | c6thplayer1 wrote: | | I made the mistake of assuming that if an American Citizen was abroad and came back to the US our laws would prohibit them from being banned for religious reasons. |
Uh... no, you didn't make a mistake with that assumption. American citizens do enjoy this quaint thing called freedom of religion.
| Quote: | | However if we had a leader that could initiate this procedure explicitly for muslims then I would be for it 100%. |
K. Thanks for letting us all know who you are. |
Your quite welcome. I make no bones about it. I dont like muslims , I wont associate with them or have anything to do with them. When they change their position about us then I'll think about changing myself. Until then its a no go. And I could care less about what anyone thinks about me and this situation.
If you could look real deep into the hearts of most Americans you might just find the same feelings. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 12:42 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| UncleJD wrote: | | c6thplayer1 wrote: |
All of this hypothetical garbage of what will happen to christians if this is allowed is just that , garbage. |
No, its not "garbage", its what every liberty loving Christian conservative in America has discussed for the last 70 years. I highly doubt a regular poster on this forum such as yourself has NEVER posted about the possibility of the government coming after Christians for their views. (think about wedding cakes just as one small example if you need help remembering) |
I think I was pretty clear about this but here it is again - If the christians started senseless killing and bombing of innocent people in the name of their views then they to should be monitored. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/8/15 12:46 pm
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diakoneo |
Funny how a dude with a bad haircut can make us change our mind about liberty.
Is history repeating itself?
Oh but that was them...we're different!
Are we? |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
12/8/15 1:32 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| diakoneo wrote: | Oh but that was them...we're different!
Are we? |
Great observation. Doesn't look like it! |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
12/8/15 1:37 pm
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Nature Boy Florida |
What was the reason Japanese-Americans were put in camps during WWII?
Since that was the greatest generation - but Dave says it is illegal - what loophole did they find that had Roosevelt put them in camps?
It seems Trump is asking for a small thing in comparison - that those Muslim Americans that travel overseas to radical countries - such as the recent murderers - be scrutinized before coming back to the U.S.
Also, can you alert the mods that someone is calling other posters fascists.
That seems over the top imho.
Also, if my family was shot by a Muslim idiot -all in the name of Allah - I would have a harsher opinion than others.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16630
12/8/15 1:43 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: | What was the reason Japanese-Americans were put in camps during WWII?
Since that was the greatest generation - but Dave says it is illegal - what loophole did they find that had Roosevelt put them in camps? |
LOL. There is no serious person in the US today who doesn't know the internment of Japanese Americans was both unnecessary and illegal. Roosevelt used the same loophole people are advocating in this thread -- not giving a single tiny hoot about the United States Constitution and the rule of law. The young soldiers who fought were indeed the Greatest Generation, but FDR was one of that time's worst.
If you're concerned about my choice of language, appeal to Doyle. I will gladly accept banishment from this forum in order to call out those who would undermine my liberty by advocating the abolition of the Bill of Rights and the rule of law. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
12/8/15 1:50 pm
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