 |
Actscelerate.com
Open Any Time -- Day or Night
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Message |
Author |
 Anyone else have issues with Ted Dekker books? |
Aaron Scott |
I keep thinking they are "Christian" books, since they are sold in Christian bookstores, but so far, despite having read several of them, they are so minimally Christian, if at all, they I don't know why they would be called such.
They are just thrillers, that's it--and not very good ones at that.
I wonder how much other stuff gets promoted by Christian books stores that really isn't very Christian (e.g., celebrity books, college coach books, and so forth)? |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6039
12/1/15 10:56 am
|
|
|
|  |
 |
|
|
| Re: Anyone else have issues with Ted Dekker books? |
Nick Park |
| Aaron Scott wrote: |
I wonder how much other stuff gets promoted by Christian books stores that really isn't very Christian (e.g., celebrity books, college coach books, and so forth)? |
Tacky drug-addled paintings by Thomas Kinkade?
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/1/15 11:22 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
bonnie knox |
| Quote: | | drug-addled paintings |
man, that was cold |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/1/15 12:08 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| Re: Anyone else have issues with Ted Dekker books? |
UncleJD |
| Nick Park wrote: | | Aaron Scott wrote: |
I wonder how much other stuff gets promoted by Christian books stores that really isn't very Christian (e.g., celebrity books, college coach books, and so forth)? |
Tacky drug-addled paintings by Thomas Kinkade? |
LOL! I couldn't agree more. Thomas Kinkade is just awful junk. Take one art appreciation class in college and if you have any capacity to actually appreciate art you'll see just how bad this junk is, not to mention the fact that his marketing of "limited editions" amounts to outright lies exploiting the masses of uneducated. Sad how the Christian bookstores have participated in this rip off.
Regarding the books, I have one, can't remember which one, read it, and forgot about it. Something about a house I think. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/1/15 12:56 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
It's not surprising that the liberal intelligentsia class find a artist that uses Americana and Christian themes in his paintings to be "lesser" than themselves.
What's amazing is the not-so intellientsia of Acts - take the shot at the same artist - pointing out his personal shortcomings or parroting the liberal artists class and saying "I am so glad we are so much better that that poor rube and his stylings".
Even more amazing that this drug addled hireling - that can't paint better than JD with one art appreciation class under his belt made MILLIONS of dollars - and provided an artistic creation in many American homes with spiritual and religious expressions mixed in.
In 2002 - Kinkade donated 2 of his paintings to the Salvation Army to help with the relief efforts of the 9/11 Muslim terrorism attacks...more than 2 million dollars was raised through that effort. Yes - Kinkade deserves to be mocked and ridiculed by those that are better then he.
By the way - if these two are correct, Kinkade should get an honorary doctorate in Marketing from Harvard...how else to explain getting his inferior drug addled works to be so popular.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/1/15 3:59 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
UncleJD |
| NBF, why don't you go buy some 1 of 2000 (with the left corner painted with a 20 bristle brush instead of the 30 bristle one like the other series, * 10). The dude was a lying opportunist praying on silly people. To pretend that the guy was some bastion of Christian principles will go well with TBN fundraising principles. There are plenty of VERY good Christian artists out there not scheming to milk every dollar they can out of people with more money than taste. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/1/15 11:16 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
UncleJD |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: |
By the way - if these two are correct, Kinkade should get an honorary doctorate in Marketing from Harvard...how else to explain getting his inferior drug addled works to be so popular.
|
That I can agree with  |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/1/15 11:23 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nick Park |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: | | It's not surprising that the liberal intelligentsia class find a artist that uses Americana and Christian themes in his paintings to be "lesser" than themselves. |
I don't think we're going to get far talking about art if we start mixing politics in and viewing everything through a left/right or liberal/conservative lens. Politics and art appreciation rarely go together. Which is why both the Nazis and the Communists (opposite extremes of the left/right axis) both spent their time persecuting talented artists while promoting horrendous monstrosities that posed as art.
My problem with Kinkade is not his so-called 'Christian themes'. I love art that takes a much more robust and biblical approach to Christianity than a picture of a cart outside a wooden church. That's why I get frustrated when Christian bookstores are cluttered with such low-level stuff when they could be introducing people to classics like Caravaggio's Sacrifice of Isaac.
| Quote: | | What's amazing is the not-so intellientsia of Acts - take the shot at the same artist - pointing out his personal shortcomings or parroting the liberal artists class and saying "I am so glad we are so much better that that poor rube and his stylings". |
Brother, I'm surprised that someone having a different opinion to you about an artist merits this kind of response. It's as well we don't talk about football isn't it?
For what it's worth, I have zero talent when it comes to painting and art. I was thrown out of art class at the age of 14 for stealing craft knives and the teacher threatened to resign if I was allowed back into the class.
But I do know what I like when it comes to art - and Kinkade's kitsch is not it.
| Quote: | Even more amazing that this drug addled hireling - that can't paint better than JD with one art appreciation class under his belt made MILLIONS of dollars - and provided an artistic creation in many American homes with spiritual and religious expressions mixed in.
|
Ah, the ability to make money. That'll always earn respect.
| Quote: | | In 2002 - Kinkade donated 2 of his paintings to the Salvation Army to help with the relief efforts of the 9/11 Muslim terrorism attacks...more than 2 million dollars was raised through that effort. Yes - Kinkade deserves to be mocked and ridiculed by those that are better then he. |
And very generous of him too, but not quite enough to make his art any better.
| Quote: | By the way - if these two are correct, Kinkade should get an honorary doctorate in Marketing from Harvard...how else to explain getting his inferior drug addled works to be so popular.
|
People will always buy trash in surprisingly high volumes. If we didn't accept that then we would have to view Harry Potter as better literature than Herman Melville or Charles Dickens, or Snoop Dog as a better composer than Mozart. 
Pax, brother.
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/2/15 2:30 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
Nick,
Thanks for he response? Was it proper to call Kinkade drug addled?
I don't think that was pertinent to his successful years.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/2/15 8:12 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
bonnie knox |
| Quote: | | But I do know what I like when it comes to art - and Kinkade's kitsch is not it. |
Now, if you had said this in the first place...
Calling his work kitsch or syrupy or sentimental is one thing. I just thought it was a cheap shot to call it "drug-addled." |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/2/15 8:16 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
| bonnie knox wrote: | | Quote: | | But I do know what I like when it comes to art - and Kinkade's kitsch is not it. |
Now, if you had said this in the first place...
Calling his work kitsch or syrupy or sentimental is one thing. I just thought it was a cheap shot to call it "drug-addled." |
Agreed. Words mean something.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/2/15 9:53 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| Kinkade... |
Aaron Scott |
I don't think anyone would claim that Kinkade is a Da Vinci. But like NBF, I can still appreciate an idealistic scene that, AT THE LEAST, promotes a worldview that seems both American and Christian.
To call him "drug-addled" was uncalled for. Ray Boltz sang some beautiful and anointed songs, all while dealing with his homosexuality. Same with Kirk Talley.
As for Dekker, I just find so much of his writing to be "dark" with little redemptive qualities in terms of God rescuing a person, etc. It's about like that trash of "dark metal" groups that could only seem to sing songs about Satan, blood, death, etc., instead of the glory of the Lord.
Last edited by Aaron Scott on 12/2/15 7:39 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6039
12/2/15 10:40 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
Never read a Dekker book.
Alice Cooper said his darkness was fueled by his own dealings with Christ and his resistance - but he knew the world was a good vs evil affair.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today!
Last edited by Nature Boy Florida on 12/2/15 11:14 am; edited 1 time in total |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/2/15 10:44 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
bonnie knox |
| Quote: | | As for Dekker, I just find so much of his writing to be "dark" with little redemptive qualities in terms of God rescuing a person, etc. |
Maybe that's why I've never read any of his books. Who needs light reading that's dark? |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/2/15 11:04 am
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nick Park |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: | Nick,
Thanks for he response? Was it proper to call Kinkade drug addled?
I don't think that was pertinent to his successful years. |
I think it depends on where his work is sold. If it is being sold on a cruise ship (as was happening last time my wife and I cruised) then it's simply a case of saying "No thanks, we're not interested."
But when they are being sold in a Christian bookstore (which is how it came up in this thread) then I think his lifestyle of alcohol, drugs and extra-marital relationships does become relevant.
I don't think Christian bookstores should sell books by authors whose lifestyles deny Christian values. The same applies to CDs by recording artistes. Should that apply to artwork too?
I guess my feelings on this would be similar to seeing a book by Zachary Timms on sale in a Christian bookstore.
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/2/15 5:39 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
Nick,
You have made a litmus test for selling materials in a Christian bookstore which I am ok with.
Shouldn't that litmus test apply even more to churches as well?
So should we surmise that you also feel that any COG minister who has been divorced, had an extra marital affair, drank any alcohol or took drugs should be disqualified from ministry in the church?
Or is it bookstores only that you have this high standard for?
Or is it just Kinkade you have singled out - and divorced church of God ministers get a free pass?
Just trying to be clear here.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/2/15 5:59 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
UncleJD |
| My disdain for Kinkade is not so much his painting as it was his false marketing. I had friends dump thousands of dollars on his "1 of 200" or whatever prints that had at least 20 "limited" series of the same exact painting, where the only difference was either the size of the frame, or the amount of brush-strokes on the print that were actually put there by the artist, bringing the count from 200 to 4000 or more. I found no honesty in that. My actual disdain for the paintings grew as the years went by until the horrible "Disney" junk. "kitsch" doesn't begin to describe that phase. To be fair in regards to his talent, he actually did a lot of impressionistic art early on that I really like. Which really drives home my point even more. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/2/15 6:05 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nature Boy Florida |
yet JD - in 2014 - his Kinkade products at #81 on bestselling licensed brands, with $425 million in annual sales. Three years after his death.
Apparently your tastes and the American public at large are quite different.
As for his troubles - I don't know why his life slipped into disrepair - perhaps he felt all alone and couldn't cope - or he couldn't handle the money (much like a Michael Jackson or Elvis Presley) - but the tragedy does not invalidate the God given gifts that were given to him - to make paintings that show what he - and apparently a plurality of Americans - felt were what they aspired life to be.
Again, I just don't understand the venom for works that give so many pleasure in their homes. It seems much like ridiculing Christians for clinging to their Bibles and their guns...and now lets add their Kinkades.
_________________
Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/2/15 6:18 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
Nick Park |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: | Nick,
You have made a litmus test for selling materials in a Christian bookstore which I am ok with.
Shouldn't that litmus test apply even more to churches as well?
So should we surmise that you also feel that any COG minister who has been divorced, had an extra marital affair, drank any alcohol or took drugs should be disqualified from ministry in the church?
Or is it bookstores only that you have this high standard for?
Or is it just Kinkade you have singled out - and divorced church of God ministers get a free pass?
Just trying to be clear here. |
I certainly think the same litmus test I applied to Kinkade should apply to Church of God ministers. Any Church of God of minister who is convicted of a DWI and has not gone through a restoration program, has an ongoing alcohol and drugs problem, and who is living with a woman other than his wife should not be permitted to preach in, let alone pastor, a church.
If a painter had a divorce, and then went through a lengthy restoration program, then that should be no bar to their paintings being sold in a Christian bookstore.
Just being clear here. 
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/2/15 6:28 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
| |
UncleJD |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: |
Apparently your tastes and the American public at large are quite different. |
That's been obvious to me since they elected Obama. Twice. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/2/15 7:45 pm
|
|
|
| |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
