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 89% of American Muslims say terrorism can never be justified |
Nick Park |
In a 2010 Gallup poll it was asked if it was ever permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians. 89% of American Muslims said no, it was never permissible under any circumstances.
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Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/9/15 5:04 pm
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| Re: 89% of American Muslims say terrorism can never be justified |
c6thplayer1 |
| Nick Park wrote: | | In a 2010 Gallup poll it was asked if it was ever permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians. 89% of American Muslims said no, it was never permissible under any circumstances. |
Kid of contradicts what was posted by another...
| Quote: | And for attacking America directly, support is also widespread: e.g. 83% of Palestinians, 62% of Jordanians, and 61% of Egyptians all favor killing Americans.
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http://www.actscelerate.com/viewtopic.php?t=84098 |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
12/9/15 5:15 pm
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| I'm not bashing just reporting what others have found |
brotherjames |
in the Center for Security Policy's poll of June 23, 2015 the following was found, to wit
Overall, the survey, which was conducted by The Polling Company for the Center for Security Policy (CSP), suggests that a substantial number of Muslims living in the United States see the country very differently than does the population overall. The sentiments of the latter were sampled in late May in another CSP-commissioned Polling Company nationwide survey.
According to the just-released survey of Muslims, a majority (51%) agreed that “Muslims in America should have the choice of being governed according to shariah.” When that question was put to the broader U.S. population, the overwhelming majority held that shariah should not displace the U.S. Constitution (86% to 2%).
More than half (51%) of U.S. Muslims polled also believe either that they should have the choice of American or shariah courts, or that they should have their own tribunals to apply shariah. Only 39% of those polled said that Muslims in the U.S. should be subject to American courts.
These notions were powerfully rejected by the broader population according to the Center’s earlier national survey. It found by a margin of 92%-2% that Muslims should be subject to the same courts as other citizens, rather than have their own courts and tribunals here in the U.S.
Even more troubling, is the fact that nearly a quarter of the Muslims polled believed that, “It is legitimate to use violence to punish those who give offense to Islam by, for example, portraying the prophet Mohammed.”
By contrast, the broader survey found that a 63% majority of those sampled said that “the freedom to engage in expression that offends Muslims or anybody else is guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution and cannot be restricted.”
Nearly one-fifth of Muslim respondents said that the use of violence in the United States is justified in order to make shariah the law of the land in this country.
https://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2015/06/23/nationwide-poll-of-us-muslims-shows-thousands-support-shariah-jihad/
gives one pause I think.
Last edited by brotherjames on 12/9/15 5:43 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 935
12/9/15 5:30 pm
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| Re: 89% of American Muslims say terrorism can never be justified |
UncleJD |
| Nick Park wrote: | | In a 2010 Gallup poll it was asked if it was ever permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians. 89% of American Muslims said no, it was never permissible under any circumstances. |
Somehow that's comforting? I was told I was stupid for saying that 7% of American Muslims believed in justified terrorism. So, 11% ??? out of 3Million American Muslims that would be 330,000 American Muslims that are OK with it.
And the holier-than-though elitist-only media just runs around on-fire with the "Trump is lying, there weren't 1,000 Muslims that cheered after 9/11".. As if they have video surveillance of every Muslim in the US on that date and know the exact head-count. Obviously if 11% feel terrorism is justifiable (yeah, I know in certain circumstances, like there's a Christian still twitching), then isn't it laughable to think there WEREN'T thousands cheering that day? |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 5:42 pm
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| Nick Park.... |
Aaron Scott |
One of the ways that terrorists "justify" their actions is that they consider, say, a child to be a "future soldier" or such. So that MIGHT be an element that needs to be teased out in this survey you mentioned; namely, just who do they consider civilians, innocent, etc?
Possible? |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6039
12/9/15 5:51 pm
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Travis Johnson |
11% of Muslims see justification in the killing of innocents to advance some sort of agenda.
That's a problem. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 7821
12/9/15 5:53 pm
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UncleJD |
| Travis Johnson wrote: | 11% of Muslims see justification in the killing of innocents to advance some sort of agenda.
That's a problem. |
yeah, 330,000 of them. And how many of the 89% were lying? |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 5:56 pm
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| Re: 89% of American Muslims say terrorism can never be justified |
Nick Park |
| UncleJD wrote: |
Somehow that's comforting? I was told I was stupid for saying that 7% of American Muslims believed in justified terrorism. So, 11% ??? out of 3Million American Muslims that would be 330,000 American Muslims that are OK with it. |
| Travis Johnson wrote: | 11% of Muslims see justification in the killing of innocents to advance some sort of agenda.
That's a problem. |
Ah, sorry guys, I forgot to post the rest of the survey.
The same survey revealed that 75% of Jews believed it was never permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians.
So, given that there 6.8 Million Jews in America, then 25%, or 1.7 million Jews see justification in the killing of innocents to advance some sort of agenda.
But wait! That is isn't your biggest problem. 71% of Catholics believed it was never permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians.
So that leaves 29% of America's 69.4 million Catholics - a staggering 20 million - seeing justification in the killing of innocents to advance some sort of agenda.
However, 71% of Protestants also believed it was never permissible for individuals or small groups to target and kill civilians.
There's 150 million Protestants in the US, so that would mean you're harboring 29% of them (over 43 million) who are potential terrorists.
Which goes to confirm what I learned growing up in Belfast, Northern Ireland. It's those Protestants and Catholics that you really need to be keeping your eye on when it comes to terrorism.
Here's a link to the Gallup survey results: http://fair.org/blog/2013/05/03/killing-civilians-is-a-more-popular-than-youd-think-especially-among-pundits/
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/9/15 6:10 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
| That's a pretty disturbing survey, and not because of the Muslim respondents. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
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12/9/15 6:32 pm
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Travis Johnson |
There is quite the epidemic of Catholics kidnapping and taking a couple hundred girls into sex slavery, flying planes into buildings, lopping off people's heads, lighting people on fire, confiscating property?
There is no moral equivalency.
Islam isn't just a religion. It's a system of conquest.
Do we love Muslims? Absolutely. But, it is a terrible religion. Not only does it not get you to heaven. It's also barbaric and at odds with any culture not Islam. |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 7821
12/9/15 6:37 pm
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bonnie knox |
| Quote: | | I was told I was stupid for saying that 7% of American Muslims believed in justified terrorism. |
Actually, no, that's not what happened. What happened is that you used a worldwide statistic and applied it to the US as if they were the same. Dave Dorsey pointed that out as a misuse of statistics. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/9/15 6:41 pm
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Nature Boy Florida |
Sounds like a garbage poll from Gallup. Without seeing the whole poll - it is tough to know how they worded the questions. Gallup certainly has eroded the last few decades. No wonder Gallup paid over $10 million dollars in fines for giving a bogus accounting of their practices a few years ago.
And as for innocents being killed - it is no surprise that the American number is as large as it is - as virtually every democrat cheers when told women have the right to choose to kill their unborn baby up until 9 months of gestation...and vote regularly to continue that practice - as it is mentioned in every election as if that is the great litmus test to be President - making sure we can kill the unborn indiscriminately. America will pay for that crime one day.
I just don't think letting more Muslims into the country is the right approach for the United States. I guess some do.
Gaining access to America should be a privilege reserved for those that believe in the American way. It has nothing to do with religion...except many that are Muslim subscribe to Sharia law over American law...something that should reject each of them on its face.
Those that also want to die in the name of Allah should also stay out. We apparently are over our limit in murderers already.
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16641
12/9/15 6:45 pm
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UncleJD |
| bonnie knox wrote: | | Quote: | | I was told I was stupid for saying that 7% of American Muslims believed in justified terrorism. |
Actually, no, that's not what happened. What happened is that you used a worldwide statistic and applied it to the US as if they were the same. Dave Dorsey pointed that out as a misuse of statistics. |
And you believe the American Muslims are different than the world's why? They simply don't have their majority and mulah kings here, if they did, there would be zero difference. And I was being WAY more than fair with the 7% number since most believe that number is MUCH higher worldwide so I thought 7% was a fair number for America alone. Turns out I was wrong. Its hard to kick against the pricks, and if you are a "moderate" Muslim claiming that Mohamed was a man of peace and not a child-raping, axe murderer, then that is exactly what you are doing. Its surprising that there is a majority of over 50% that don't believe in terrorism based on the facts of that religion. In fact I think if you pin them down on questions about Israel, then you'd be surprised what happens to that number since they don't have to answer to the state in the country on their position on Israel (kind of a free pass).
Last edited by UncleJD on 12/9/15 6:58 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 6:55 pm
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Nick Park |
| Travis Johnson wrote: | There is quite the epidemic of Catholics kidnapping and taking a couple hundred girls into sex slavery, flying planes into buildings, lopping off people's heads, lighting people on fire, confiscating property?
There is no moral equivalency.
Islam isn't just a religion. It's a system of conquest.
Do we love Muslims? Absolutely. But, it is a terrible religion. Not only does it not get you to heaven. It's also barbaric and at odds with any culture not Islam. |
Travis, I agree that it's a terrible religion. That's why next week I'm appearing as an expert witness for the defense in a court case where a pastor is being prosecuted for calling Islam 'Satanic and heathen'.
But my point wasn't about the respective merits of different religions. My point was to show the hypocrisy of those who misuse statistics to create McCarthyist scares with nonsense about thousands of terrorists hiding in the US and waiting to murder you all in your beds.
That silly hysteria plays into the hands of terrorists.
As I've mentioned in another thread, I grew up in a society where terrorism was a daily occurrence. I had friends murdered by (Catholic) terrorists. Their bombs and guns were, by the way, for the most part, funded by US citizens of Irish descent who thought they donating to a noble cause.
I'm not bitter about any of it. I'm just glad it's over now. In the end a small group of terrorists realized they were never going to win if the rest of us refused to be panicked into hysteria. Most of us got on with living our lives, trusting law enforcement to do their best to protect us, and understanding that they could only ever kill a tiny fraction of us.
Many of us kept on befriending Catholics, even though over 50% of them voted for a party that was affiliated to the terrorists. We kept on taking holidays in the US, even though US courts refused to extradite escaped terrorists on the grounds that their murders were 'political'. Basically, we refused to let terrorism dominate our lives. We realized that the only thing to fear was fear itself.
And it's because of that experience that I grieve to see Americans (a nation that I love - even though I'd never want to live there) falling for harsh and fear-filled rhetoric.
_________________
Senior Pastor, Solid Rock Church, Drogheda
National Overseer, Church of God, Ireland
Executive Director, Evangelical Alliance Ireland
http://eaiseanchai.wordpress.com/ |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1021
12/9/15 6:58 pm
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| What a pile of bull |
JimmieDavis |
| I don't trust the survey. I think nick park is a liberal fishing for pathetic support of his liberal ideaology. We are under attack in 30 years you want recognize America. Stop it, fix it then they can resume their migrating to America. Till then go move in next to nick. He's got a soft spot for you. |
Friendly Face
Posts: 219
12/9/15 7:02 pm
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UncleJD |
| Nick Park wrote: | | trusting law enforcement to do their best to protect us. |
And there's the difference between Europe and the US in a nutshell. And its not fear, make no mistake, its anger and justice that we are feeling, and we are not inclined to wait on our government to make it happen, we demand it of them and arm ourselves in case they are too weak to perform their duty.
And I love Ireland too btw, I've had some very good coworkers that I've spent a lot of time with over the years, mostly from Cork. So please don't take what I say as anti-europe, its more that I don't want to see European replacement continue like we've seen it in Africa, namely Egypt, and I'm determined not to see it here.
Last edited by UncleJD on 12/9/15 7:04 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 7:04 pm
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bonnie knox |
This has nothing to do with what I think about Muslims here or abroad. It has to do with you using statistics improperly and then claiming you were called stupid when that's not what was said.
If you want to say what your opinion or gut feeling or impression or observation is, have at it, but don't start with a statistic and then start trying to make that statistic say what you want it to say.
| UncleJD wrote: | | bonnie knox wrote: | | Quote: | | I was told I was stupid for saying that 7% of American Muslims believed in justified terrorism. |
Actually, no, that's not what happened. What happened is that you used a worldwide statistic and applied it to the US as if they were the same. Dave Dorsey pointed that out as a misuse of statistics. |
And you believe the American Muslims are different than the world's why? They simply don't have their majority and mulah kings here, if they did, there would be zero difference. And I was being WAY more than fair with the 7% number since most believe that number is MUCH higher worldwide so I thought 7% was a fair number for America alone. Turns out I was wrong. Its hard to kick against the pricks, and if you are a "moderate" Muslim claiming that Mohamed was a man of peace and not a child-raping, axe murderer, then that is exactly what you are doing. Its surprising that there is a majority of over 50% that don't believe in terrorism based on the facts of that religion. In fact I think if you pin them down on questions about Israel, then you'd be surprised what happens to that number since they don't have to answer to the state in the country on their position on Israel (kind of a free pass). |
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[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/9/15 7:04 pm
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UncleJD |
| bonnie knox wrote: | This has nothing to do with what I think about Muslims here or abroad. It has to do with you using statistics improperly and then claiming you were called stupid when that's not what was said.
If you want to say what your opinion or gut feeling or impression or observation is, have at it, but don't start with a statistic and then start trying to make that statistic say what you want it to say. |
Ok I take back the 7% figure, its 20 to 25% worldwide. And there is no evidence that American Muslims would be any different. So thanks for allowing me to correct myself. A full 600,000 American Muslims likely lean toward "extremist" (normal) Muslim beliefs. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 7:06 pm
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| Re: What a pile of bull |
UncleJD |
| JimmieDavis wrote: | | I don't trust the survey. I think nick park is a liberal fishing for pathetic support of his liberal ideaology. |
That is a personal attack and shouldn't be tolerated on this Christian board. Its ok to have a heated debate (I'm in the middle of a couple myself), but that is rude and directed toward a known and respected poster here. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3145
12/9/15 7:09 pm
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bonnie knox |
| Quote: | | So thanks for allowing me to correct myself. |
You may also retract the statement that someone called you stupid.  |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 14803
12/9/15 7:11 pm
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