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 Confession: I've become cynical and skeptical |
p5harri |
First, I would characterize myself as a Classical Pentecostal person. A majority of my beliefs and faith came from being in a very traditional COG atmosphere in the 80's. Think no wedding rings, no movies, no everything.
I definitely know what the real stuff looks like though; altars that were full, revivals that went on for weeks on end, more importantly multiple miracles and healing.
My sincere question to you is this: "How do you keep from becoming cynical when you see people chasing everything new fad that comes down the pipe looking for that next Word they believe will change their life?"
They'll drive 2 hours to listen to someone because they have a following.
It's becoming harder for me in particular to not be cynical about the direction the Pentecostal/Charismatic faith is headed for many.
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We are beating the bushes for mice and the lions are tearing us apart. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1705
1/21/19 1:55 pm
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Cojak |
I fit into the same mold except for much earlier COG. I became too cynical as a pastor and became an atheist while standing in the pulpit. When I actually realized it, I resigned in three days. Telling my wife "There is no God this is all a game. I will not stand in front of these good folk and teach something that is not real."
It was years before I realized in my soul, that I was wrong, and HE forgave me and accepted me back.
Now I try NOT to be very skeptical. It takes prayer, but I remember what happened. I am a firm believer since my experience there are some in the pulpit because they know nothing else and are just going thru the motions. I keep the thought, "It is my salvation I know about, not someone else's."
You bring up a VERY IMPORTANT SUBJECT, P5 
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Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24275
1/21/19 5:53 pm
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| Re: Confession: I've become cynical and skeptical |
Dave Dorsey |
| p5harri wrote: | | My sincere question to you is this: "How do you keep from becoming cynical when you see people chasing everything new fad that comes down the pipe looking for that next Word they believe will change their life?" |
Sorrow, grief, hope, and longing.
Old time Pentecostals sought righteousness through outward "holiness" and asceticism. Almost all now recognize that as righteousness by works, and recognize that those practices are antithetical to the gospel. Almost all now recognize those beliefs as bondages from which they are now freed.
But, it seems that many have simply traded that works-based righteousness for another -- the aggressive pursuit of experiences, of new and fresh words, of new doctrines and never before heard revelations. The devotion to radical and extraordinary practices to prove one's desire to God, so that He may bestow righteousness and the gift -- the reward -- of His presence. It is the same works-based Christianity and is just as opposed to the gospel. I have heard it referred to in some circles as "climbing the mountain of devotion". If there is a better metaphor for the belief that one can merit God's presence through works, I do not know what it is.
On top of that, charismatic theology is now saturated with word of faith doctrine and practice. All these things combine to draw believers ever further from the simplicity of the gospel, and ever further from the truly radical message of God's unmerited and un-earnable favor and grace.
How do you keep from becoming cynical? It is very difficult. But I believe the answer may be found in sorrow, grief, hope, and longing. Sorrow that so many have been drawn away and have exchanged the truth of God for such obvious lies. Grief, knowing that is only grace that separates you from them, and only grace that has given you an awareness of the things to which they are blind. Hope, because Jesus knows His own, and will rescue them from bondage and deceit. And longing -- Spirit-driven longing -- to see the truth of God's word, the genuine move of His Spirit, the "real thing" -- and to see believers fulfilled and satisfied in Him rather than always needing the next new thing.
I struggle with this. I struggle with this immensely. But my prayer is that God would take my disgust and turn it into sorrow, and take my cynicism and turn it into grief, so that I can be broken by this and moved to prayer for those caught up in it. That, too, is a work of grace and a work of grace alone, but it is my prayer that He would do that in me. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
1/21/19 6:15 pm
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| Re: Confession: I've become cynical and skeptical |
Resident Skeptic |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | | p5harri wrote: | | My sincere question to you is this: "How do you keep from becoming cynical when you see people chasing everything new fad that comes down the pipe looking for that next Word they believe will change their life?" |
Sorrow, grief, hope, and longing.
Old time Pentecostals sought righteousness through outward "holiness" and asceticism. Almost all now recognize that as righteousness by works, and recognize that those practices are antithetical to the gospel. Almost all now recognize those beliefs as bondages from which they are now freed.
But, it seems that many have simply traded that works-based righteousness for another -- the aggressive pursuit of experiences, of new and fresh words, of new doctrines and never before heard revelations. The devotion to radical and extraordinary practices to prove one's desire to God, so that He may bestow righteousness and the gift -- the reward -- of His presence. It is the same works-based Christianity and is just as opposed to the gospel. I have heard it referred to in some circles as "climbing the mountain of devotion". If there is a better metaphor for the belief that one can merit God's presence through works, I do not know what it is.
On top of that, charismatic theology is now saturated with word of faith doctrine and practice. All these things combine to draw believers ever further from the simplicity of the gospel, and ever further from the truly radical message of God's unmerited and un-earnable favor and grace.
How do you keep from becoming cynical? It is very difficult. But I believe the answer may be found in sorrow, grief, hope, and longing. Sorrow that so many have been drawn away and have exchanged the truth of God for such obvious lies. Grief, knowing that is only grace that separates you from them, and only grace that has given you an awareness of the things to which they are blind. Hope, because Jesus knows His own, and will rescue them from bondage and deceit. And longing -- Spirit-driven longing -- to see the truth of God's word, the genuine move of His Spirit, the "real thing" -- and to see believers fulfilled and satisfied in Him rather than always needing the next new thing.
I struggle with this. I struggle with this immensely. But my prayer is that God would take my disgust and turn it into sorrow, and take my cynicism and turn it into grief, so that I can be broken by this and moved to prayer for those caught up in it. That, too, is a work of grace and a work of grace alone, but it is my prayer that He would do that in me. |
A post worth framing. Great word.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
1/21/19 7:46 pm
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p5harri |
Cojak - that was perfect, several years ago when I was questioning some acts by others, God seemed to say:†Don’t worry about them, you follow me.â€
Dave - Very good about made me cry. When I’m around these people I hear, “I just want more of God.†The thing is so do I, I want a deeper and stronger relationship with more him than anything. I just don’t believe I have to chase people, drive to the next state or catch the next wave to find it.
_________________
We are beating the bushes for mice and the lions are tearing us apart. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1705
1/21/19 8:07 pm
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| This spoke to me, I love it when that happens. |
Cojak |
Quote:
I believe the answer may be found in sorrow, grief, hope, and longing. Sorrow that so many have been drawn away and have exchanged the truth of God for such obvious lies. Grief, knowing that is only grace that separates you from them, and only grace that has given you an awareness of the things to which they are blind. Hope, because Jesus knows His own, and will rescue them from bondage and deceit. And longing -- Spirit-driven longing -- to see the truth of God's word, the genuine move of His Spirit, the "real thing" -- and to see believers fulfilled and satisfied in Him rather than always needing the next new thing. ....... end quote
You have got to love it when you feel it hit your soul. THANKS....
speaking about additions to scripture...........
This should be at the top but I wanted to add it because I see this, and it hurts, concerning the 'simplicity of THE GOSPEL:'
.................these things combine to draw believers ever further from the simplicity of the gospel, and ever further from the truly radical message of God's unmerited and un-earnable favor and grace. .....
I love that thought.
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24275
1/21/19 9:07 pm
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Carolyn Smith |
The only answer I have is to stay focused on Jesus. People will let you down, because we are all human. Jesus is the only one that will not fail you.
My older son went through a Master's Commission program when he was in his early 20s. I noticed he became very cynical by the end of it, and when I mentioned it to him, he said something to the effect of, "Either you become cynical or you have to drop out." A sad statement for a young man...and perhaps part of the reason he is not serving the Lord now.
Keep your eyes on Jesus.
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"More of Him...less of me."
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Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5909
1/21/19 11:45 pm
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Preacher777 |
Dave, you really made some great points here. Many people would rather chase a feeling on the outside rather than repent and let the Holy Spirit burn up sin as we offer our bodies as living sacrifices.
We must speak the truth in love with those caught in this trap and pray for them to come to a knowledge of the truth. I feel sorry for these people because many have never been taught and experienced a true move of God's grace, repentance towards God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, one who has never been in Pentecostal services with a true move of God can easily be lead astray by people who can mix crowd psychology with music. |
Friendly Face
Posts: 434
1/22/19 6:43 am
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p5harri |
My first experience with the COG was in Eastern NC in the early 80's, I'm sure you remember what that was like. Kenly Campmeeting was the best.
The COG had a few minor things, like clothesline preaching, etc...But I remember going to revivals that lasted weeks and not dreading a single minute of being there.
I've seen the real thing in a small local church where people weren't chasing anything but a closer walk with God. Where God moved and people walked away changed...for good.
I've said this before but I think a lot about what the priest most of felt as he walked into the Holy of Holies. The awe and fear and wonder of that experience.
_________________
We are beating the bushes for mice and the lions are tearing us apart. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1705
1/22/19 9:01 am
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p5harri |
Maybe I'm not so much cynical as I worry that I have absolutely no desire to chase those things or feelings I see others chasing.
Personally I'd rather spend my time in prayer, studying my Bible or smaller gathering soaking up what some unknown true man of God has to say.
_________________
We are beating the bushes for mice and the lions are tearing us apart. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1705
1/22/19 9:13 am
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