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Trump wusses down on border wall
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Post Quiet Wyatt
I voted third party last time. I would never ever vote for anyone like Hillary or Donald. I have always been unaligned politically with any party, but I have never and would never vote for any Democrat, period. I have voted for Republicans before, but as I have said before, I have lost faith that the GOP really believes in its own platform, especially with regard to abortion and reducing the size and spending of the govt. [Insert Acts Pun Here]
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12/21/18 8:04 am


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Post Resident Skeptic
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
I voted third party last time. I would never ever vote for anyone like Hillary or Donald. I have always been unaligned politically with any party, but I have never and would never vote for any Democrat, period. I have voted for Republicans before, but as I have said before, I have lost faith that the GOP really believes in its own platform, especially with regard to abortion and reducing the size and spending of the govt.


For any real and lasting change, we must focus on States' rights being expressed through Article 5.
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12/21/18 8:09 am


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Post Resident Skeptic
Rand Paul: Promise To End The War In Syria Is Why Trump Won The Election






https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2018/12/20/rand_paul_promise_to_end_war_in_syria_is_why_trump_won_the_election.html?fbclid=IwAR1Frd6LZ-FLoFZo_-rC5hXfcEj7qrz_6rKGmCUCGFBm0KkFO7D7wZM03P4
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12/21/18 8:11 am


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Post Dave Dorsey
RS, this is kind of unrelated, but I'm very curious about it.

I gather you disagree that the 2018 elections were any sort of repudiation of the president. I also gather that you expect him to win fairly handedly in 2020. What sort of electoral event would it take for you to acknowledge the public does not support this president (irrespective of whether they do or don't now). If this president is defeated in 2020, would you be willing to acknowledge that is a repudiation of Trump, or is such an outcome only possible in the event of a deep state conspiracy?

Second question: I gather that you think this president is very competent and is deftly navigating the halls of power. What would it take, if anything, to persuade you that is not the case? What would the president need to do, if anything, to lose your support and approval?
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
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12/21/18 9:05 am


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Post UncleJD
Well this discussion was for nothing. Trump's getting the wall unless jackal Senators refuse to vote for it. If he does get it, he wins in 2020.

Sadly, there's a good chance that outgoing RINOs will figure out some way not to vote for it because its Trump, when the same RINOs would have demanded it under Obama.


As for Syria, this is actually much more in keeping with Trump's opinions prior to the election. Its funny how Obama got the Nobel prize for simply saying he would pull troops out of Iraq in one year no matter how destabilizing it would be , then he did not, then when he did he practically created ISIS, but that's fine he's the great Obama. Now with the mass epidemic known as TDS, Trump is somehow wrong to pull our troops out of Syria. I only hope he pulls them out of the entire middle east myself.
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12/21/18 9:20 am


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Post Dave Dorsey
The wall bill is definitely DOA in the Senate. It will be filibustered by the Dems, so even if every GOP senator voted in favor, it would fail.

Trump is putting heavy pressure on McConnell to end the legislative filibuster (not the first time) so it can have a chance at passing. McConnell is wisely continuing to refuse, for sure recalling his infamous words to Harry Reid concerning the end of the filibuster for judicial nominees: "You'll regret this, and you may regret this a lot sooner than you think."

Anyway, the bill with the $5.7b is DOA even if every GOP senator votes in favor.
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12/21/18 9:39 am


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Post UncleJD
Dave Dorsey wrote:
The wall bill is definitely DOA in the Senate. It will be filibustered by the Dems, so even if every GOP senator voted in favor, it would fail.

Trump is putting heavy pressure on McConnell to end the legislative filibuster (not the first time) so it can have a chance at passing. McConnell is wisely continuing to refuse, for sure recalling his infamous words to Harry Reid concerning the end of the filibuster for judicial nominees: "You'll regret this, and you may regret this a lot sooner than you think."

Anyway, the bill with the $5.7b is DOA even if every GOP senator votes in favor.


Then I hope Trump shuts down the government good and long like he said. It certainly won't make him any less popular in DC, and some backbone is exactly what he needs right now. I think they could and should go nuclear, we will NEVER have the kind of government again that can get 60 votes on anything meaningful, period.
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12/21/18 9:53 am


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Post Dave Dorsey
UncleJD wrote:
I think they could and should go nuclear, we will NEVER have the kind of government again that can get 60 votes on anything meaningful, period.

There are instances where it would be good to be able to push through meaningful and needed legislation, but I'd argue that those are few and far between. In the vast majority of cases, obstructed government is good government. The thought of Democrats being able to push through any kind of legislation they want on a simple majority vote is enough to make my hair stand on end.
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12/21/18 10:00 am


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Post UncleJD
Dave Dorsey wrote:
The thought of Democrats being able to push through any kind of legislation they want on a simple majority vote is enough to make my hair stand on end.


Yet it will happen the next time they take congress. The left is extremely radicalized. The next time they hold a majority it won't be the democrats of the past, it will be the new generation of radicals. They have pledged themselves to it. To ignore that fact and somehow insist on the bipartisan (and yet unconstitutional) "rule", is suicide. Did you watch the president's speech about the wall? The statistics of crime, drugs, murder, sexual assault, sex traffic, and money is staggering. Anyone voting against this is only doing it because its Trump or they actually do hate America.

Anyway, I think it was premature to say that Trump "wussied down" (though he did give signals he was doing so, he's not the best at signalling his intent, or maybe its his negotiation tactics that still keep us scratching our heads)
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12/21/18 10:15 am


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Post Eddie Robbins
UncleJD wrote:
Well this discussion was for nothing. Trump's getting the wall unless jackal Senators refuse to vote for it. If he does get it, he wins in 2020.

Sadly, there's a good chance that outgoing RINOs will figure out some way not to vote for it because its Trump, when the same RINOs would have demanded it under Obama.


As for Syria, this is actually much more in keeping with Trump's opinions prior to the election. Its funny how Obama got the Nobel prize for simply saying he would pull troops out of Iraq in one year no matter how destabilizing it would be , then he did not, then when he did he practically created ISIS, but that's fine he's the great Obama. Now with the mass epidemic known as TDS, Trump is somehow wrong to pull our troops out of Syria. I only hope he pulls them out of the entire middle east myself.


It all depends on if he gets Mexico to pay for it. That was his promise, not the American people paying for it. I have no problem paying for it but, like GHW Bush, a lie will hurt him.
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12/21/18 10:30 am


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Post UncleJD
Eddie Robbins wrote:

It all depends on if he gets Mexico to pay for it. That was his promise, not the American people paying for it. I have no problem paying for it but, like GHW Bush, a lie will hurt him.


Eddie, only those who didn't vote for him would worry about who pays for it. In the long run Mexico will be paying for it from the positive cash flow reversal. I know that's not the same as writing a check, but from a business point of view it is better.

BTW, the go-fund-me is over $11 Million. I fully intend to contribute at least my $80 share if the Senate fails to act.
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12/21/18 10:49 am


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Post Dave Dorsey
UncleJD wrote:
BTW, the go-fund-me is over $11 Million. I fully intend to contribute at least my $80 share if the Senate fails to act.

You shouldn't. While the US treasury will accept private donations, the Constitution prohibits that money from being spent for a particular purpose without a Congressional appropriation.

Unless the Dems vote to pass a bill appropriating money for a wall, your $80 will go toward interest on the national debt, and that's assuming it ever makes to the treasury at all.
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12/21/18 10:59 am


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Post Resident Skeptic
Dave Dorsey wrote:
RS, this is kind of unrelated, but I'm very curious about it.

I gather you disagree that the 2018 elections were any sort of repudiation of the president. I also gather that you expect him to win fairly handedly in 2020. What sort of electoral event would it take for you to acknowledge the public does not support this president (irrespective of whether they do or don't now). If this president is defeated in 2020, would you be willing to acknowledge that is a repudiation of Trump, or is such an outcome only possible in the event of a deep state conspiracy?

Second question: I gather that you think this president is very competent and is deftly navigating the halls of power. What would it take, if anything, to persuade you that is not the case? What would the president need to do, if anything, to lose your support and approval?


Was Reagan's mid-term loss in 1982 a repudiation of his policies? You seem to be ignoring the fact that he GAINED in the Senate. By your thinking then that was an endorsement of his ideas. Furthermore, I do not think the events that will determine whether Trump gets re-elected have even happened yet.
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12/21/18 12:09 pm


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Post Dave Dorsey
Resident Skeptic wrote:
Was Reagan's mid-term loss in 1982 a repudiation of his policies? You seem to be ignoring the fact that he GAINED in the Senate. By your thinking then that was an endorsement of his ideas. Furthermore, I do not think the events that will determine whether Trump gets re-elected have even happened yet.

I wasn't intending to necessarily say that 2018 was a repudiation, I was just trying to get a better understanding of how a true believer sees things.

How about the second question?
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12/21/18 12:40 pm


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Post Resident Skeptic
Dave Dorsey wrote:
Resident Skeptic wrote:
Was Reagan's mid-term loss in 1982 a repudiation of his policies? You seem to be ignoring the fact that he GAINED in the Senate. By your thinking then that was an endorsement of his ideas. Furthermore, I do not think the events that will determine whether Trump gets re-elected have even happened yet.

I wasn't intending to necessarily say that 2018 was a repudiation, I was just trying to get a better understanding of how a true believer sees things.

How about the second question?


Not so much a "true believer" but a rational student of history. Trump's House losses were mild compared to those of others.
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12/21/18 1:01 pm


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Post Nature Boy Florida
UncleJD wrote:
Dave Dorsey wrote:
The thought of Democrats being able to push through any kind of legislation they want on a simple majority vote is enough to make my hair stand on end.


Yet it will happen the next time they take congress. The left is extremely radicalized. The next time they hold a majority it won't be the democrats of the past, it will be the new generation of radicals. They have pledged themselves to it. To ignore that fact and somehow insist on the bipartisan (and yet unconstitutional) "rule", is suicide. Did you watch the president's speech about the wall? The statistics of crime, drugs, murder, sexual assault, sex traffic, and money is staggering. Anyone voting against this is only doing it because its Trump or they actually do hate America.

Anyway, I think it was premature to say that Trump "wussied down" (though he did give signals he was doing so, he's not the best at signalling his intent, or maybe its his negotiation tactics that still keep us scratching our heads)


He wussed down.

He only changed his mind when a bunch of folks called him on it.

But - it won't pass if they don't do the nuclear option (which they won't ) and everyone knows it.

The time to fight for this was 23 months ago.

The country may be ready for a Marco Rubio this time. Marco has been working hard to change his lightweight reputation from last time.
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12/21/18 1:05 pm


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Post Resident Skeptic
Nature Boy Florida wrote:
UncleJD wrote:
Dave Dorsey wrote:
The thought of Democrats being able to push through any kind of legislation they want on a simple majority vote is enough to make my hair stand on end.


Yet it will happen the next time they take congress. The left is extremely radicalized. The next time they hold a majority it won't be the democrats of the past, it will be the new generation of radicals. They have pledged themselves to it. To ignore that fact and somehow insist on the bipartisan (and yet unconstitutional) "rule", is suicide. Did you watch the president's speech about the wall? The statistics of crime, drugs, murder, sexual assault, sex traffic, and money is staggering. Anyone voting against this is only doing it because its Trump or they actually do hate America.

Anyway, I think it was premature to say that Trump "wussied down" (though he did give signals he was doing so, he's not the best at signalling his intent, or maybe its his negotiation tactics that still keep us scratching our heads)


He wussed down.

He only changed his mind when a bunch of folks called him on it.

But - it won't pass if they don't do the nuclear option (which they won't ) and everyone knows it.

The time to fight for this was 23 months ago.

The country may be ready for a Marco Rubio this time. Marco has been working hard to change his lightweight reputation from last time.


He did not wuss out. He was simply not wanting Federal workers missing pay at Christmas time. It will not pass the Senate and he knows it. He thus plans on using other means to fund it and still will. He cannot win with some of yall.
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12/21/18 1:13 pm


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Post Dave Dorsey
Do you guys have any thoughts on the 80 border walls worth of welfare Trump just joyfully gave to farmers to help them escape the consequences of his ill-considered tariffs? [Insert Acts Pun Here]
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12/21/18 3:44 pm


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Post UncleJD
How long should America go with unequal trade? 40, 60, 80, 200 years? Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
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12/21/18 4:34 pm


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Post Dave Dorsey
So... you're in favor of purchasing 400b in debt from the Chinese to repay farmers for having fixed "uneven trade"? [Insert Acts Pun Here]
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12/21/18 4:52 pm


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