Actscelerate.com Forum Index Actscelerate.com
Open Any Time -- Day or Night
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
r/Actscelerate

Can the Lord Jesus return at anytime?

 
   Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Message Author
Post Can the Lord Jesus return at anytime? Cojak
I post that question because I believe he will. BUT as I have pointed out here I am attending a store front church (for lack of a better alternative close by) and the preacher said in a sermon, Our Lord cannot return because the Word has not been preached in: xyz ( and here he listed several countries in Africa, honestly I could not understand the names of the countries. I know he pointed to two on the map under Algeria.)

Along with this difference in my convictions the pastor does not condemn college or deeper learning of the scripture, but as QW mentioned once, this group does press disciple ship and pastoral teaching locally.

Why do you believe the Lord could come anytime (if you do)?

THANKS!
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24269
12/12/18 1:30 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
My understanding of Scripture is that the gospel of the kingdom must be preached into all nations, tribes and tongues before the end shall come, just as our Lord Himself said was the case in Matthew 24. The passages which warn believers to be ready for the Lord’s return do not necessarily require one to hold to the idea of an any-moment rapture. One of the most well-known passages, concerning the Foolish and Wise Virgins in Matthew 25, directly follows Matthew 24, in which Jesus expressly teaches that His return and gathering of the elect will be immediately AFTER the tribulation, the worst time of all time, the worst that ever shall be, according to how Jesus describes it. Believers are exhorted in Scripture to watch, to be sober, awake, ready for His appearing, because that is the kind of spiritual alertness we should always possess. We must never grow lax in our spiritual sobriety, nor should we ever slumber spirituality.

Also, the statements in Scripture about the Lord coming as a thief each reveal in their own context that the warning is not concerning imminence as such, but is instead about those who are not zealous and awake for the Lord.

For example:

1 Thess 5:1 Now concerning the times and the seasons, brothers, you have no need to have anything written to you. 2 For you yourselves are fully aware that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. 3 While people are saying, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as labor pains come upon a pregnant woman, and they will not escape. 4 But you are not in darkness, brothers, for that day to surprise you like a thief. 5 For you are all children of light, children of the day. We are not of the night or of the darkness. 6 So then let us not sleep, as others do, but let us keep awake and be sober. 7 For those who sleep, sleep at night, and those who get drunk, are drunk at night. 8 But since we belong to the day, let us be sober, having put on the breastplate of faith and love, and for a helmet the hope of salvation. 9 For God has not destined us for wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, ESV

And:

Revelation 3:1b “‘I know your works. You have the reputation of being alive, but you are dead. 2Wake up, and strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your works complete in the sight of my God. 3Remember, then, what you received and heard. Keep it, and repent. If you will not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come against you. 4Yet you have still a few names in Sardis, people who have not soiled their garments, and they will walk with me in white, for they are worthy. ESV

Hope this helps,

QW
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/12/18 2:13 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Along with QW, I am post-trib, BUT... Aaron Scott
(Matthew 24:22 KJV) And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

(Romans 9:28 KJV) For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.


God is sovereign. When He decides to cut things short, He can and will. To "cut short" or to "shorten," in these cases, implies there was more to do, but God thought best to cut it short.

I HIGHLY doubt that there is ANY nation that has not heard the gospel. There may be individual PEOPLE who have not heard the gospel, but I'm pretty sure that every NATION has. Consider that in the 10 days between Jesus' ascension and Pentecost, people died. They never heard the gospel. Same in the YEARS after Pentecost. Those PEOPLE never heard the gospel.

It is MY opinion that such will get similar treatment as the ones that Jesus preached to while in the tomb.

So, yes, I think the Lord could come tonight...IF He cuts it short in righteousness.
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6027
12/12/18 5:59 am


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
https://joshuaproject.net/resources/articles/has_everyone_heard [Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/12/18 6:13 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Are you differentiating from roughridercog
Rapture and second coming of Christ?
_________________
Doctor of Bovinamodulation
Acts Mod
Posts: 25306
12/12/18 7:02 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post diakoneo
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
https://joshuaproject.net/resources/articles/has_everyone_heard


Wow! Looks like there is still a lot of work yet to be done. Many years ago when I was a fledgling MIP student the Church of God made it a goal to reach the "unreached people groups" Alabama was assigned the Gheg of Albania.

Whatever happened to that effort?

The USA is by far the richest Evangelical nation in the world and yet most of our money goes to keep our buildings operating, pew sitters comfortable and systems in place. Jesus said where much is given, much is required.

So as to His return, He is above all things merciful!
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
12/12/18 7:41 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Something to consider... Aaron Scott
While it is a noble impulse that would cause the Joshua Project to hold that a group is not considered "reached" unless 2% of that group are Christians, it is equally important to note that Jesus didn't say that "the gospel must first be preached until all groups are at least 2% Christian."

So, I still believe that Jesus could come tonight...even though I am post-trib.
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6027
12/12/18 8:04 am


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Reply with quote
Post May I ask again? roughridercog
What is the difference between the rapture and The coming of Christ. Are many treating it as the same event?

By the way, this is one of those deep interesting discussions some say never happen here. Laughing
_________________
Doctor of Bovinamodulation
Acts Mod
Posts: 25306
12/12/18 8:17 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: May I ask again? Quiet Wyatt
roughridercog wrote:
What is the difference between the rapture and The coming of Christ. Are many treating it as the same event?

By the way, this is one of those deep interesting discussions some say never happen here. :lol:


I will be absolutely thrilled if pretrib turns out to be true. My study of the Scriptures has led me to the inescapable conclusion that the rapture and return of Christ must occur in rapid fashion. I find no evidence in Scripture for a seven-year separation between the rapture and the second coming, nor for any secret rapture at all.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/12/18 8:32 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: Something to consider... Quiet Wyatt
Aaron Scott wrote:
While it is a noble impulse that would cause the Joshua Project to hold that a group is not considered "reached" unless 2% of that group are Christians, it is equally important to note that Jesus didn't say that "the gospel must first be preached until all groups are at least 2% Christian."

So, I still believe that Jesus could come tonight...even though I am post-trib.


It is not just the Joshua Project. That is just one example. Missions agencies are in full agreement that the gospel has not yet been preached into all ethnic groups. The word translated as “nations” in the Great Commission and in the Matthew 24 reference is ”ethnos,” and does not mean a modern nation-state.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/12/18 8:35 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: May I ask again? Aaron Scott
roughridercog wrote:
What is the difference between the rapture and The coming of Christ. Are many treating it as the same event?

By the way, this is one of those deep interesting discussions some say never happen here. Laughing



This is what I believe: Jesus will not come again...before He comes again. That is, there is not a coming that precedes his...well, coming. The notion of the rapture is, I believe, a sincere and well-intentioned belief, but one that is not strongly supported in scripture.

The coming of the Lord is bomb-proof and absolute in the scriptures. But to hold that the Lord will come BEFORE the coming of the Lord we see so clearly in the scriptures just won't work, I don't believe.

HOWEVER, I do not believe it is a heaven or hell issue in terms of whether you believe it or not. There are men far, far, far better than I am who believe the Lord will rapture then church...then will return after the tribulation to pick up the rest.
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6027
12/12/18 1:11 pm


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Reply with quote
Post QW... Aaron Scott
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
Aaron Scott wrote:
While it is a noble impulse that would cause the Joshua Project to hold that a group is not considered "reached" unless 2% of that group are Christians, it is equally important to note that Jesus didn't say that "the gospel must first be preached until all groups are at least 2% Christian."

So, I still believe that Jesus could come tonight...even though I am post-trib.


It is not just the Joshua Project. That is just one example. Missions agencies are in full agreement that the gospel has not yet been preached into all ethnic groups. The word translated as “nations” in the Great Commission and in the Matthew 24 reference is ”ethnos,” and does not mean a modern nation-state.




Bro, I hear you. But I have a hard time believing that, if not every person, then every ethnic group (with the possible exception of some Stone Age tribes) have not heard of Jesus. If just one person in an ethnic group has heard of Jesus, that would meet the criteria, no?

And if not, consider a "making-excuses" case can be made that would claim that unless every PERSON has heard the gospel, etc....

Further, it might be that some nations were reached GENERATIONS ago...but did not respond to the gospel (or it may have been eradicated in some way). I have heard that some nations that used to be Christian (e.g., Syria) later became Muslim due to the fact that the Muslims didn't persecute the non-Catholic Christians as badly as did the Catholic Church. Or reduced their taxes, etc.

Not good reasons, I know. But if there is a tribe that, 1500 years ago had a missionary come and preach to them, but failed to convert or what have you, it seems it would be fair to check that ethnic group off of our list...unless we mean that each ethnic group must be reached in every generation before the Lord returns.

What do you think?
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6027
12/12/18 1:22 pm


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Reply with quote
Post Cojak
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
https://joshuaproject.net/resources/articles/has_everyone_heard

Very good article QW thanks. Lots to chew on...
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24269
12/14/18 12:24 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Da Sheik
I think the NT teaches the imminent return of Christ. Therefore, I can’t accept there must be some event that prevents that from happening. There are also scriptures about the future of Israel as a nation that must be reconciled. In my mind, the rapture of the Church helps to reconcile those differences. Revelation devotes a significant amount of attention to the events of the Tribulation. It also seems to center around events in the Middle East, particularly the nation of Israel. Jesus describes the events of the Tribulation with a decided emphasis on Israel and Jerusalem. We read in Revelation that angels participate in the preaching of the Gospel during the Tribulation (Rev 14:6-7). So in my mind, the angel finishes the work left undone at the time of the rapture.

Something has to happen to bring the focus of human history back to Israel (remember Paul’s promise for future Israel in Romans 11). The most logical shift would result from the “fulness of the Gentiles” (Romans 11:25) being raptured and then the focus is on Israel.
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1860
12/14/18 12:37 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: Along with QW, I am post-trib, BUT... Cojak
Aaron Scott wrote:
(Matthew 24:22 KJV) And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

(Romans 9:28 KJV) For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.


God is sovereign. When He decides to cut things short, He can and will. To "cut short" or to "shorten," in these cases, implies there was more to do, but God thought best to cut it short.

I HIGHLY doubt that there is ANY nation that has not heard the gospel. There may be individual PEOPLE who have not heard the gospel, but I'm pretty sure that every NATION has. Consider that in the 10 days between Jesus' ascension and Pentecost, people died. They never heard the gospel. Same in the YEARS after Pentecost. Those PEOPLE never heard the gospel.

It is MY opinion that such will get similar treatment as the ones that Jesus preached to while in the tomb.

So, yes, I think the Lord could come tonight...IF He cuts it short in righteousness.

These are the points I remember my daddy using. I know that is where I have this inbred thought it can happen at any minute.
As has been mentioned I definitely do not see it as a 'salvation' make or break.
Being mostly in the COG, I have NEVER heard from a COG pulpit that our Lord could not come tonight.

I am really enjoying the intelligent responses from you here on the forum, the discussion, other than a lurker basically is much above my pay grade.
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24269
12/14/18 12:41 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Acts-celerate Terms of Use | Acts-celerate Policy
Contact the Administrator.


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group :: Spelling by SpellingCow.