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Post From Kev KevinWallace
In a separate post, a dear poster communicated several innuendos that I think are confusing and perhaps even hurtful for some.

My greatness weakness is speaking my heart. I probably should refrain from seeming reactionary or responding to this post. Perhaps the ignorance and untrue suggestions of the post provoked me to post a number of things I have had in my heart anyway. Whatever the case, this post presumes a great hypothetical circumstance that would never be an issue. It seems super-hypothetical primarily because as much as I loved/love the COG, I do not know if I would ever hold credentials with her again. It is even more hypothetical because I understand the nature of the COG. When a person leaves they are the black sheep forever. And I totally understand why. I am not addressing these issues because I have an ambition to want your vote one day. You took a hypothetical post and leveled 5 accusations that in a veiled way behind a veiled identitiy caused good people to get caught up in dishonest narratives.

His points are bolded followed by my response.



1. End the policy of refusing to address women as elder. He lets them come to meetings but makes it very clear that only men can be elders, not women. (So I find it odd that he left the COG over women in ministry and continues to exploit it. Hmm)

This must be a joke. We have 5 female pastors on our team. 6 other administrators that are female and operate in administration gifts. Several of them have a prophetic grace on their lives and prophesy frequently. You seem to posit that I struggle with women being in ministry or having the title of elder or Pastor. Actually the opposite is true. I actually struggled with women being pastors in our denomination, pared tithe of tithes to the mother church, and then run to Assembly to sit in the back and hear men berate them as if they were Junior Varsity. Imagine sending in tithe dollars and leading local churches, only to come to general assembly and be told they are unqualified to sit on the floor of the general council. That is a travesty. Furthermore I find it nauseating that conversations have ensued on the floor of the general council that warranted a deep and painful conversation with my own biological daughters. Trying to explain what mean-spirited bishops “meant” when harsh words were spoken. And the greatest travesty of all, is that leaders who could shape and give direction to the GC have remained largely silent for the past decade. If they don't speak to it in the future, the culture will not change. Perhaps some can ignore that. Even chalk it up as “part of the system”.... or look in the daughters eyes and decree things like “it will change one day baby”. Not me. Not now. Not ever. So before you suggest such an ignorant thought behind a alias who has only posted 8 Times on acts... get your story straight.


2. The Highland Park Church come under the auspices of the Church of God, like all other Church of God’s do, instead of being his personal 501c3 property.


Actually all other COG’s don’t. Many do. A growing number don’t. BY the way, I received the blessing of my state overseer and a committee member before purchasing the Highland Park property. NOTHING was done without the blessing of leadership when we bought the property in 2013.


3. Give an account of all the money that was raised while he was in the COG that went to missionary projects in Uruguay and Guatemala.

Would love to do that for you but when we departed, we left the records and accounting with the COG so I am sure they would be glad to show that to you. You would find the orphanage we built there that has babies and kids in to this day. You Would also find the property that we bought in Uruguay that has blessed missionaries and pastors from that beautiful nation.


4. Bring his benefactor back with him and let them pay for off some more COG debt. (which is the real reason he left. Did not take long to realize all that money he was raking in and the COG was the one holding the deed. If you think it was about women in ministry see point 1 and then see me for some ocean front property in Arizona.)

I understand that cynical people can have a difficult time attributing favor to God. If you look at my life there really is no other explanation for all that has happened except that God has been better to me than i deserve. I am not sharp, enough, smart enough or smooth enough. In all of our ministry, we have attempted to use influence, financial blessing or any other mechanism of favor God has given us to bless those around us. While many people are aware we left a building in Ooltewah to those who remained in the COG, many don’t know that we were able to pay off $478,000 of debt that was owed on the east lake COG campus in a matter of weeks after moving our inner city campus there. This was helpful for the state. We eventually would sell that building and took $250,000 of the proceeds of the sell of that building and gave it to Mitch Corder and the youth camp renovation on signal mountain. You are welcome to verify this with Anyone on the state council of Tennessee. Finally, I have no benefactors. We have been blessed by God with partners who help resource the vision and advance the kingdom. It is a scriptural principle. Moving to the inner city, to an area full of poverty and illiteracy is not usually the kind of move people make to increase their portfolio. We are just trying to follow God.


5. I’ve read about all that he “lost”and “gave up” following his “convictions”. I’d be interested in seeing his net worth before and after following his “convictions”

I don’t have to explain leaving the denomination. You have no clue what I lost or gave up. It was the hardest thing I have ever done. If you think i did it to inure myself and increase my net worth that says more about you than me. If my actions were not obedient to God, no one had more to lose than I did. I suppose some would say I took a financial hit upon my departure when over 22 ministry engagements were cancelled within 3 days as a result of the system. And it is obvious you are a part of it.


While there were a number of things that caused me frustration and some things that caused hurt, those weren't the reasons I left. I left following the whisper of God. I have said little to nothing since my departure. I will simply say while disconnecting was the hardest thing I have ever done, I continue to love the people of the COG. Do I still dislike the system? Absolutely. But I regularly pray for its leaders and continue to believe that God has great things in store for the COG. And if I can manage to keep my heart right, love people and stay in a place of prayer, I also believe God in His grace has great things in store for us as well. Imagine that… God being big enough to bless all of us.


ps. MDBishop if you will let me know what happened in our journey that made you so upset I will work to fix it. Life is too short to hate folk.
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8/7/18 3:10 pm


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Post Re: From Kev UncleJD
KevinWallace wrote:
In a separate post, a dear poster communicated several innuendos that I think are confusing and perhaps even hurtful for some.

My greatness weakness is speaking my heart. I probably should refrain from seeming reactionary or responding to this post. Perhaps the ignorance and untrue suggestions of the post provoked me to post a number of things I have had in my heart anyway. Whatever the case, this post presumes a great hypothetical circumstance that would never be an issue. It seems super-hypothetical primarily because as much as I loved/love the COG, I do not know if I would ever hold credentials with her again. It is even more hypothetical because I understand the nature of the COG. When a person leaves they are the black sheep forever. And I totally understand why. I am not addressing these issues because I have an ambition to want your vote one day. You took a hypothetical post and leveled 5 accusations that in a veiled way behind a veiled identitiy caused good people to get caught up in dishonest narratives.

His points are bolded followed by my response.



1. End the policy of refusing to address women as elder. He lets them come to meetings but makes it very clear that only men can be elders, not women. (So I find it odd that he left the COG over women in ministry and continues to exploit it. Hmm)

This must be a joke. We have 5 female pastors on our team. 6 other administrators that are female and operate in administration gifts. Several of them have a prophetic grace on their lives and prophesy frequently. You seem to posit that I struggle with women being in ministry or having the title of elder or Pastor. Actually the opposite is true. I actually struggled with women being pastors in our denomination, pared tithe of tithes to the mother church, and then run to Assembly to sit in the back and hear men berate them as if they were Junior Varsity. Imagine sending in tithe dollars and leading local churches, only to come to general assembly and be told they are unqualified to sit on the floor of the general council. That is a travesty. Furthermore I find it nauseating that conversations have ensued on the floor of the general council that warranted a deep and painful conversation with my own biological daughters. Trying to explain what mean-spirited bishops “meant” when harsh words were spoken. And the greatest travesty of all, is that leaders who could shape and give direction to the GC have remained largely silent for the past decade. If they don't speak to it in the future, the culture will not change. Perhaps some can ignore that. Even chalk it up as “part of the system”.... or look in the daughters eyes and decree things like “it will change one day baby”. Not me. Not now. Not ever. So before you suggest such an ignorant thought behind a alias who has only posted 8 Times on acts... get your story straight.


2. The Highland Park Church come under the auspices of the Church of God, like all other Church of God’s do, instead of being his personal 501c3 property.


Actually all other COG’s don’t. Many do. A growing number don’t. BY the way, I received the blessing of my state overseer and a committee member before purchasing the Highland Park property. NOTHING was done without the blessing of leadership when we bought the property in 2013.


3. Give an account of all the money that was raised while he was in the COG that went to missionary projects in Uruguay and Guatemala.

Would love to do that for you but when we departed, we left the records and accounting with the COG so I am sure they would be glad to show that to you. You would find the orphanage we built there that has babies and kids in to this day. You Would also find the property that we bought in Uruguay that has blessed missionaries and pastors from that beautiful nation.


4. Bring his benefactor back with him and let them pay for off some more COG debt. (which is the real reason he left. Did not take long to realize all that money he was raking in and the COG was the one holding the deed. If you think it was about women in ministry see point 1 and then see me for some ocean front property in Arizona.)

I understand that cynical people can have a difficult time attributing favor to God. If you look at my life there really is no other explanation for all that has happened except that God has been better to me than i deserve. I am not sharp, enough, smart enough or smooth enough. In all of our ministry, we have attempted to use influence, financial blessing or any other mechanism of favor God has given us to bless those around us. While many people are aware we left a building in Ooltewah to those who remained in the COG, many don’t know that we were able to pay off $478,000 of debt that was owed on the east lake COG campus in a matter of weeks after moving our inner city campus there. This was helpful for the state. We eventually would sell that building and took $250,000 of the proceeds of the sell of that building and gave it to Mitch Corder and the youth camp renovation on signal mountain. You are welcome to verify this with Anyone on the state council of Tennessee. Finally, I have no benefactors. We have been blessed by God with partners who help resource the vision and advance the kingdom. It is a scriptural principle. Moving to the inner city, to an area full of poverty and illiteracy is not usually the kind of move people make to increase their portfolio. We are just trying to follow God.


5. I’ve read about all that he “lost”and “gave up” following his “convictions”. I’d be interested in seeing his net worth before and after following his “convictions”

I don’t have to explain leaving the denomination. You have no clue what I lost or gave up. It was the hardest thing I have ever done. If you think i did it to inure myself and increase my net worth that says more about you than me. If my actions were not obedient to God, no one had more to lose than I did. I suppose some would say I took a financial hit upon my departure when over 22 ministry engagements were cancelled within 3 days as a result of the system. And it is obvious you are a part of it.


While there were a number of things that caused me frustration and some things that caused hurt, those weren't the reasons I left. I left following the whisper of God. I have said little to nothing since my departure. I will simply say while disconnecting was the hardest thing I have ever done, I continue to love the people of the COG. Do I still dislike the system? Absolutely. But I regularly pray for its leaders and continue to believe that God has great things in store for the COG. And if I can manage to keep my heart right, love people and stay in a place of prayer, I also believe God in His grace has great things in store for us as well. Imagine that… God being big enough to bless all of us.


ps. MDBishop if you will let me know what happened in our journey that made you so upset I will work to fix it. Life is too short to hate folk.
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8/7/18 3:39 pm


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Post see... told ya aprilmay2.0
This is why I would vote for Bishop Wallace if he came back and if I could vote.

Clear, articulate, and with kindness, he addressed personal attacks.

Thank you Kev- for your gracious response.\


And thank you for reading this post. Good to know you are still active! I always thought I was one of your favorite posters. Im so glad to know you're following me and my reach is multi-denominational.
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8/7/18 4:40 pm


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Post Tom Sterbens
Kevin,

This is yet another example of gutless sniping.
As I've said a THOUSAND times...my favorite verse of scripture is:

"If you have ought with your brother...do not go to him, but rather write salacious gossip about him on an internet forum under a pseudo name."

Your answer was gracious, forthright, honorable, factual and under your own name - nothing remotely reflective of the original post to which you responded. Smile
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8/7/18 4:55 pm


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Post Re: From Kev NewTimeUrbanPreacher
Changed My Mind.

Last edited by NewTimeUrbanPreacher on 8/8/18 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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8/7/18 5:00 pm


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Post I’ve got this one Mods and Kev aprilmay2.0
New Urban guy- Any attempt to out a poster or those identity can result in a temporary or permanent ban.

Trust me on this one. You want to tread lightly asking these types of questions. The isle of patmos is lonely.


Last edited by aprilmay2.0 on 8/7/18 5:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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8/7/18 5:04 pm


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Post Also Tom and Kev aprilmay2.0
I appreciate you guys following this but just for clarity sake- New Urbans post was a response to a thread and not my original post or within the framework of my thread.

I want to be clear that I was hypothetically discussing kev’s second Cool Ming and listed good reasons why someone should vote for Kev (is that what we call him now? Sounds hip and trendy so I’m in)

Thanks
aM
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8/7/18 5:07 pm


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Post Typical answer... seanr25
He answered every question you posed. Man up and respond, either accept what he stated or challenge them. You made some claims that brought up his integrity, if you have some proof of wrong doing, jump off the internet and bring up charges against him. More than likely, you are a spineless instigator that loves nothing more than hurting others, accusing them of things that you yourself are doing. Put up or shut up. Friendly Face
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8/7/18 5:21 pm


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Post Re: From Kev Tom Sterbens
NewTimeUrbanPreacher wrote:
KevinWallace wrote:
In a separate post, a dear poster communicated several innuendos that I think are confusing and perhaps even hurtful for some.

My greatness weakness is speaking my heart. I probably should refrain from seeming reactionary or responding to this post. Perhaps the ignorance and untrue suggestions of the post provoked me to post a number of things I have had in my heart anyway. Whatever the case, this post presumes a great hypothetical circumstance that would never be an issue. It seems super-hypothetical primarily because as much as I loved/love the COG, I do not know if I would ever hold credentials with her again. It is even more hypothetical because I understand the nature of the COG. When a person leaves they are the black sheep forever. And I totally understand why. I am not addressing these issues because I have an ambition to want your vote one day. You took a hypothetical post and leveled 5 accusations that in a veiled way behind a veiled identitiy caused good people to get caught up in dishonest narratives.

His points are bolded followed by my response.



1. End the policy of refusing to address women as elder. He lets them come to meetings but makes it very clear that only men can be elders, not women. (So I find it odd that he left the COG over women in ministry and continues to exploit it. Hmm)

This must be a joke. We have 5 female pastors on our team. 6 other administrators that are female and operate in administration gifts. Several of them have a prophetic grace on their lives and prophesy frequently. You seem to posit that I struggle with women being in ministry or having the title of elder or Pastor. Actually the opposite is true. I actually struggled with women being pastors in our denomination, pared tithe of tithes to the mother church, and then run to Assembly to sit in the back and hear men berate them as if they were Junior Varsity. Imagine sending in tithe dollars and leading local churches, only to come to general assembly and be told they are unqualified to sit on the floor of the general council. That is a travesty. Furthermore I find it nauseating that conversations have ensued on the floor of the general council that warranted a deep and painful conversation with my own biological daughters. Trying to explain what mean-spirited bishops “meant” when harsh words were spoken. And the greatest travesty of all, is that leaders who could shape and give direction to the GC have remained largely silent for the past decade. If they don't speak to it in the future, the culture will not change. Perhaps some can ignore that. Even chalk it up as “part of the system”.... or look in the daughters eyes and decree things like “it will change one day baby”. Not me. Not now. Not ever. So before you suggest such an ignorant thought behind a alias who has only posted 8 Times on acts... get your story straight.


2. The Highland Park Church come under the auspices of the Church of God, like all other Church of God’s do, instead of being his personal 501c3 property.


Actually all other COG’s don’t. Many do. A growing number don’t. BY the way, I received the blessing of my state overseer and a committee member before purchasing the Highland Park property. NOTHING was done without the blessing of leadership when we bought the property in 2013.


3. Give an account of all the money that was raised while he was in the COG that went to missionary projects in Uruguay and Guatemala.

Would love to do that for you but when we departed, we left the records and accounting with the COG so I am sure they would be glad to show that to you. You would find the orphanage we built there that has babies and kids in to this day. You Would also find the property that we bought in Uruguay that has blessed missionaries and pastors from that beautiful nation.


4. Bring his benefactor back with him and let them pay for off some more COG debt. (which is the real reason he left. Did not take long to realize all that money he was raking in and the COG was the one holding the deed. If you think it was about women in ministry see point 1 and then see me for some ocean front property in Arizona.)

I understand that cynical people can have a difficult time attributing favor to God. If you look at my life there really is no other explanation for all that has happened except that God has been better to me than i deserve. I am not sharp, enough, smart enough or smooth enough. In all of our ministry, we have attempted to use influence, financial blessing or any other mechanism of favor God has given us to bless those around us. While many people are aware we left a building in Ooltewah to those who remained in the COG, many don’t know that we were able to pay off $478,000 of debt that was owed on the east lake COG campus in a matter of weeks after moving our inner city campus there. This was helpful for the state. We eventually would sell that building and took $250,000 of the proceeds of the sell of that building and gave it to Mitch Corder and the youth camp renovation on signal mountain. You are welcome to verify this with Anyone on the state council of Tennessee. Finally, I have no benefactors. We have been blessed by God with partners who help resource the vision and advance the kingdom. It is a scriptural principle. Moving to the inner city, to an area full of poverty and illiteracy is not usually the kind of move people make to increase their portfolio. We are just trying to follow God.


5. I’ve read about all that he “lost”and “gave up” following his “convictions”. I’d be interested in seeing his net worth before and after following his “convictions”

I don’t have to explain leaving the denomination. You have no clue what I lost or gave up. It was the hardest thing I have ever done. If you think i did it to inure myself and increase my net worth that says more about you than me. If my actions were not obedient to God, no one had more to lose than I did. I suppose some would say I took a financial hit upon my departure when over 22 ministry engagements were cancelled within 3 days as a result of the system. And it is obvious you are a part of it.


While there were a number of things that caused me frustration and some things that caused hurt, those weren't the reasons I left. I left following the whisper of God. I have said little to nothing since my departure. I will simply say while disconnecting was the hardest thing I have ever done, I continue to love the people of the COG. Do I still dislike the system? Absolutely. But I regularly pray for its leaders and continue to believe that God has great things in store for the COG. And if I can manage to keep my heart right, love people and stay in a place of prayer, I also believe God in His grace has great things in store for us as well. Imagine that… God being big enough to bless all of us.


ps. MDBishop if you will let me know what happened in our journey that made you so upset I will work to fix it. Life is too short to hate folk.


started to go through these point by point, but there is no use. you and Sterbens love to attack pen names when its convenient. I'll ask you to humor me with one final question. Is your real Name the only one you have ever or currently use on acts?


Years ago I used one, "Theonomous".
The guy who owns "Peanut Butter" gave me the login a hundred years ago (No, I am not the owner or originator of the name). I used that one for a half dozen or so hyper-satirical posts. And then there is my "Apostle Tom" screen name.
Oh yeah...and there was "Loimos" (really like that one - "the bug" - I should see if it is still active).

I think that about covers it. You?

And I don't attack pen names "when it is convenient," I do it to specifically attack gutlessness whenever it shows up. Smile
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8/7/18 5:24 pm


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Post Nature Boy Florida
Thanks Kevin. You didn't owe anyone anything, but I appreciate you being open about your ministry.

I still expect your greatest days of ministry are ahead.

NBF, and my real alter ego, are big fans. Anyone that posts on Acts or talks to me personally all know this already. Nattering Naboobs of Negativism will always be with us. Keep pressing forward!
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8/7/18 5:48 pm


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Post Re: From Kev NewTimeUrbanPreacher
changed my mind

Last edited by NewTimeUrbanPreacher on 8/8/18 2:32 pm; edited 1 time in total
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8/7/18 6:55 pm


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Post Re: Typical answer... NewTimeUrbanPreacher
seanr25 wrote:
He answered every question you posed. Man up and respond, either accept what he stated or challenge them. You made some claims that brought up his integrity, if you have some proof of wrong doing, jump off the internet and bring up charges against him. More than likely, you are a spineless instigator that loves nothing more than hurting others, accusing them of things that you yourself are doing. Put up or shut up.


got your popcorn out? Looks like you are enjoying the show
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8/7/18 7:15 pm


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Post Dave Dorsey
NewTimeUrbanPreacher:

I don't have a problem you asking questions on this forum. I also don't have a problem with you sharing your opinion here about public actions that anyone has taken, so long as you are not stating falsehoods or attacking them. (As an example, I have no issue with Tom describing your posts as gutless -- that may be sharp, but it is not a personal attack).

With that said, I have a big problem with the tone you have used here and in the other thread. It is completely unacceptable for this forum and it should be considered unacceptable for anyone who names the name of Christ.

Please consider this a stern and final warning to tone it down and interact respectfully. The tone of your posts is not acceptable here.
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8/7/18 7:17 pm


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Post Re: From Kev Dave Dorsey
KevinWallace wrote:
ps. MDBishop if you will let me know what happened in our journey that made you so upset I will work to fix it. Life is too short to hate folk.

Not only that, but eternity is too long.

"Whoever says he is in the light and hates his brother is still in darkness. ... Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him." (1 John 2:9, 3:15, ESV)
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8/7/18 7:20 pm


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Post NewTimeUrbanPreacher
Dave Dorsey wrote:
NewTimeUrbanPreacher:

I don't have a problem you asking questions on this forum. I also don't have a problem with you sharing your opinion here about public actions that anyone has taken, so long as you are not stating falsehoods or attacking them. (As an example, I have no issue with Tom describing your posts as gutless -- that may be sharp, but it is not a personal attack).

With that said, I have a big problem with the tone you have used here and in the other thread. It is completely unacceptable for this forum and it should be considered unacceptable for anyone who names the name of Christ.

Please consider this a stern and final warning to tone it down and interact respectfully. The tone of your posts is not acceptable here.


I have acted respectfully. If not show me where, other than AFTER I was attacked and you sternly warned no one for that
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8/7/18 7:25 pm


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Post Re: From Kev SouthFloridaman
NewTimeUrbanPreacher wrote:
really wasn't asking you Tommy. You're no where near as relevant as you think you are

ReallyNTUP, I think in God’s book Tom is pretty important. Way more than you think you are. Do you even pastor a church? Your probably a desk jockey in Cleveland that found some way to the middle.
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8/7/18 8:20 pm


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Post Re: From Kev Tom Sterbens
NewTimeUrbanPreacher wrote:
really wasn't asking you Tommy. You're no where near as relevant as you think you are


First - I genuinely misunderstood. In your post in question you said, "you and Sterbens..." I thought the question you asked was to "you and Sterbens."

Last - I don't know that I've ever thought of myself as "relevant," so the rebuke is not a surprise nor an offense. In fact, for decades, if asked I will tell people I think my strength is being suspicious of my own righteousness. I have found that keeps me from being caught off guard when others offer observations such as yours.

I "do" try to apply the Word of God practically (which may or may not result in "relevant") - such as I have offered here in this thread. I do not think the method of conflict resolution you have employed is not Biblical. If I knew who you were I would have called you personally to tell you that. But as it stands I can only address my perception of that departure in principle.

Thanks...
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8/7/18 8:32 pm


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Post JLarry
Kevin i have never met you but I have great respect for you. To me it is sad that anyone would council a preaching engagement because you pulled out of the cog.

As far as your accuser. Remember the devil is the accuser of the brethren.
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8/7/18 9:27 pm


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Post Carolyn Smith
Kevin - I really hate that all this unpleasantness was stirred up here. It hurts when people speak against you in public, especially when it's not true. I'm glad you took time out of your busy life and ministry to respond, and it only confirms to me that you are who you seem to be. I've never met you, only read your online stuff and heard you preach on FB and via CD. I believe you are a man of integrity who has a heart for God and His people. That's important because not everyone has the ability to be real.

I have a lot of respect for you and for following after God at the high price you paid. You don't owe any of us an explanation, but I'm really glad that you stopped by today and shared your heart. I believe God has great things in store for your ministry. Folks are not breaking down doors to do inner city ministry, but it's obvious you are called to do this, and you do it with excellence. No way God won't bless the ones who are reaching His heart.
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8/7/18 10:45 pm


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Post There is a vain ... Mat
There is a vain in human nature to "curse" those who we perceive as "braking fellowship" with us (as in, who needs them anyway, they were in it for themselves, etc). From the forced departure of Tomlinson, to the current day departure of strong local churches to the independent ranks, that inherit nature reveals itself. Its hard for many to accept that God speaks to his servants outside the avenues of the beloved denomination. It takes an incredible man to follow God's call.

I don't think there is any expectation of a continued relationship, from either side, other than brothers in Christ. As to being "independent," that means not part of, not accountable to, not reliant on, not sharing in, having no voice and no future in the denomination. Its him and what he feels God calls him to do.

What hard attitudes do is to undermine any prospect of reconciliation, in any other form. Being raised in the COGOP (and part of AJT's family), I have felt for many years I would rather see the denomination join the AG, than "kiss the ring" of the COG. Now, relationships have improved from my childhood years in Cleveland, but there is still a vain in some COG folks which make's me think twice.

I see independent Pentecostal churches with their own network of ministries as the future. They will raise under the leadership of an anointed pastor, and they will fall when the church takes on the characteristics of a denomination in the name of sustainability.

MAT

PS The man's gone - he did it right - leave him alone - perfect your own selves.
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8/8/18 6:52 am


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