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 Evangelists or Pastors? |
FLRon |
For those of you who are pastoring and rarely if ever bring an evangelist in to preach,favoring instead to use another pastor, would you mind sharing your reasoning?
I’ve heard all kinds of reasons through the years, and I’m just curious if those are still viable (in your opinion) or is there something else driving your decision?
_________________
“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/17/18 8:45 pm
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| Re: Evangelists or Pastors? |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| FLRon wrote: | For those of you who are pastoring and rarely if ever bring an evangelist in to preach,favoring instead to use another pastor, would you mind sharing your reasoning?
I’ve heard all kinds of reasons through the years, and I’m just curious if those are still viable (in your opinion) or is there something else driving your decision? |
Ron are you a pastor or evangelist? |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15564
3/17/18 9:37 pm
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| First, what is your definition of an evangelist? |
roughridercog |
An itinerant preacher or someone who plants and establishes churches where there are none?
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Doctor of Bovinamodulation |
Acts Mod
Posts: 25306
3/17/18 9:50 pm
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| Re: First, what is your definition of an evangelist? |
FLRon |
| roughridercog wrote: | | An itinerant preacher or someone who plants and establishes churches where there are none? |
I’ll answer your question even though you sidestepped mine. An evangelist as I have been taught is each and every one of us who are saved. In the context to which I am asking, an Evangelist is one who travels either to a church or other facility in order to preach the gospel for the sole purpose of winning the lost or encouraging the faithful.
I do not define an Evangelist as a church planter, though others may do so I suppose.
_________________
“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/17/18 10:37 pm
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| Re: Evangelists or Pastors? |
FLRon |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | FLRon wrote: | For those of you who are pastoring and rarely if ever bring an evangelist in to preach,favoring instead to use another pastor, would you mind sharing your reasoning?
I’ve heard all kinds of reasons through the years, and I’m just curious if those are still viable (in your opinion) or is there something else driving your decision? |
Ron are you a pastor or evangelist? |
OTCP, I have been a church planter as well as a pastor. If I were to be labeled anything today it would most likely be an Evangelist, if the definition of an Evangelist is one who preaches the gospel either in a church or other facility for the sole purpose of winning the lost or encouraging the faithful.
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“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/17/18 10:43 pm
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| Re: First, what is your definition of an evangelist? |
roughridercog |
| FLRon wrote: | | roughridercog wrote: | | An itinerant preacher or someone who plants and establishes churches where there are none? |
I’ll answer your question even though you sidestepped mine. An evangelist as I have been taught is each and every one of us who are saved. In the context to which I am asking, an Evangelist is one who travels either to a church or other facility in order to preach the gospel for the sole purpose of winning the lost or encouraging the faithful.
I do not define an Evangelist as a church planter, though others may do so I suppose. |
I didn't sidestep, I asked for clarification of your definition. That being done, I will answer. I always used pastors for revivals because I knew them, they had demonstrated their stability, and I found that they had a common vision. This is not to say an evangelist cannot.
But through the years, I saw too many pastors have to spend a ton of time doing damage control after an evangelist would tear things up through questionable doctrine or just remarks made from the pulpit.
So I chose to use fellow pastors.
Now may I share a personal observation valid to no one but myself?
A lot a people we call evangelists are pastors without a church and just waiting for one to open up.
Just my "personal" observation.
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Doctor of Bovinamodulation |
Acts Mod
Posts: 25306
3/18/18 6:52 am
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| Re: First, what is your definition of an evangelist? |
sheepdogandy |
| roughridercog wrote: | | FLRon wrote: | | roughridercog wrote: | | An itinerant preacher or someone who plants and establishes churches where there are none? |
I’ll answer your question even though you sidestepped mine. An evangelist as I have been taught is each and every one of us who are saved. In the context to which I am asking, an Evangelist is one who travels either to a church or other facility in order to preach the gospel for the sole purpose of winning the lost or encouraging the faithful.
I do not define an Evangelist as a church planter, though others may do so I suppose. |
I didn't sidestep, I asked for clarification of your definition. That being done, I will answer. I always used pastors for revivals because I knew them, they had demonstrated their stability, and I found that they had a common vision. This is not to say an evangelist cannot.
But through the years, I saw too many pastors have to spend a ton of time doing damage control after an evangelist would tear things up through questionable doctrine or just remarks made from the pulpit.
So I chose to use fellow pastors.
Now may I share a personal observation valid to no one but myself?
A lot a people we call evangelists are pastors without a church and just waiting for one to open up.
Just my "personal" observation. |
Ditto! 
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Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor SPWC
Congregational Church of God
www.spwc.church |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 7298
3/18/18 8:39 am
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| Hasn't the COG "System" Created |
Mark Ledbetter |
this doleful circumstance?
In years gone by and when I took my exhorter's test a major question asked, a question no where I could find could to be legitimate in the materials given for me to prepare, was, "Have you conducted at least two weeks successful revival?"
When I answered, "No." there was a look of horror and they asked, "Why not?" I replied, "I've been pastoring for five months." They passed me.
During Camp Meeting there was a deluge of eager evangelists soliciting me to allow them to come conduct a revival. This was the mentality of the age and set the paradigm some pastors lament - untested, unproved evangelists wanting to fill their schedule (they depended upon it to make ends meet).
The more successful and the more bookings to fill their calendar, they saw as a hope to achieve their goal - to be one of the State Evangelist (with the financial benefits, as well as the notoriety).
Many, if not most, had a change in calling from Evangelist to Pastor. Some had run the circuit so long there was no freshness. Some married, had kids, and needed the stability (these thoughts are what I've been told by men who made the transition).
We missed it somehow. Many of the eager evangelists sitting on our pews should have been taught to become "lay speakers" who functioned chiefly in the local setting. They would have, should have been an invaluable tool to the local pastor - provided the local pastor was not of the jealous type (another unfortunate contribution to the mix."
When I served on the State Ordination Exam Board, I began to believe we made the process way too easy. I was/am not against wanting to help those who want to serve, but too many were motivated by the "glamour," the "excitement" and were not serious about their Bible Study - just a few "red hots" is all they needed rather than spending the time necessary to craft a message God may have wanted the local congregation to hear.
As a district pastor I attended a revival where a man I sat on the Ordination exam and signed the ordination reluctantly. Just didn't feel right.
He was preaching to a dead house and so he got excited and said something off the wall (I don't remember what it was) and excitedly came to where I was sitting and he said, "Isn't that right, Brother Ledbetter?"
I just sat there and stared at him and he took off running to the other side of the church and everybody got excited.
I can remember thinking then, "I wish I could take my name off his papers."
I believe the Church of God "system" contributed to this doleful circumstance.
By the way, if you need an evangelist (not looking for a church to pastor or espouse an off-the-wall message, but a message of salvation, revival, restoration, and the Return of Jesus our Messiah), give me a call.
While I have some major themes I believe God wants me to address, what I usually do is sit down and ask, "Lord, you had Jesus write the seven churches a specific letter for each respective church. Is there something specific You would like for me to address at this church (to which I was going to preach)?"
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God-Honoring
Christ-Centered
Bible-Based
Spirit-Led
(This is how I want to be) |
Golf Cart Mafia Associate
Posts: 2109
3/18/18 10:09 am
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| Re: Evangelists or Pastors? |
skinnybishop |
| FLRon wrote: | For those of you who are pastoring and rarely if ever bring an evangelist in to preach,favoring instead to use another pastor, would you mind sharing your reasoning?
I’ve heard all kinds of reasons through the years, and I’m just curious if those are still viable (in your opinion) or is there something else driving your decision? |
I've answered that question before, on this forum, as a matter of fact. I use pastors 99% of the time. Here is why:
I've never had a fellow pastor preach to my congregation on giving...just before his offering is received.
I've never had a fellow pastor play games during the altar call like, "Straighten the crooked leg", or "Is anybody here named John, Bill, or Joe? I have word from the Lord from you?"
I've never had a fellow pastor speak to my congregation in an arrogant, condensing tone, when he didn't get the response he wanted.
I've never had a fellow pastor provide me with a "needs list" prior to coming. (specific brand of bottled water, snacks for the hotel room, etc)
I've never had a fellow pastor abandon an altar call, so he could go man his product booth, in the foyer.
I've never had any of that mess with a fellow pastor.
I've had all of that mess with evangelists.
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Eddie Wiggins |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1055
3/18/18 12:28 pm
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| Re: Evangelists or Pastors? |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| skinnybishop wrote: |
I've never had a fellow pastor provide me with a "needs list" prior to coming. (specific brand of bottled water, snacks for the hotel room, etc) |
I bet he brought his own armor bearer too.... |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15564
3/18/18 12:46 pm
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| Re: Hasn't the COG "System" Created |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Mark Ledbetter wrote: | | He was preaching to a dead house and so he got excited and said something off the wall (I don't remember what it was) and excitedly came to where I was sitting and he said, "Isn't that right, Brother Ledbetter?" |
Probably something like Moses spoke in tongues based on Exodus 32:32 |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15564
3/18/18 12:47 pm
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| Re: First, what is your definition of an evangelist? |
FLRon |
| roughridercog wrote: | | FLRon wrote: | | roughridercog wrote: | | An itinerant preacher or someone who plants and establishes churches where there are none? |
I’ll answer your question even though you sidestepped mine. An evangelist as I have been taught is each and every one of us who are saved. In the context to which I am asking, an Evangelist is one who travels either to a church or other facility in order to preach the gospel for the sole purpose of winning the lost or encouraging the faithful.
I do not define an Evangelist as a church planter, though others may do so I suppose. |
I didn't sidestep, I asked for clarification of your definition. That being done, I will answer. I always used pastors for revivals because I knew them, they had demonstrated their stability, and I found that they had a common vision. This is not to say an evangelist cannot.
But through the years, I saw too many pastors have to spend a ton of time doing damage control after an evangelist would tear things up through questionable doctrine or just remarks made from the pulpit.
So I chose to use fellow pastors.
Now may I share a personal observation valid to no one but myself?
A lot a people we call evangelists are pastors without a church and just waiting for one to open up.
Just my "personal" observation. |
In my humble opinion, a preacher looking for a church to pastor is NOT an Evangelist.
I understand every thing you said, and have witnessed all of it and more. On the other hand, we are to know them which labor among us, and that falls squarely in the lap of the host pastor. A shepherd must guard his flock against the wolves, and that includes those in sheep’s clothing does it not?
When I was a pastor I got in a lot of hot water from my leadership for refusing to allow a certain individual in my pulpit, an individual that most pastors seemed to enjoy. Because I knew this person’s reputation was one of shenanigans and outright false doctrine I said absolutely not. I never regretted my decision and would do the same a thousand times even knowing the consequences.
_________________
“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/18/18 2:21 pm
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| Re: Evangelists or Pastors? |
FLRon |
| skinnybishop wrote: | | FLRon wrote: | For those of you who are pastoring and rarely if ever bring an evangelist in to preach,favoring instead to use another pastor, would you mind sharing your reasoning?
I’ve heard all kinds of reasons through the years, and I’m just curious if those are still viable (in your opinion) or is there something else driving your decision? |
I've answered that question before, on this forum, as a matter of fact. I use pastors 99% of the time. Here is why:
I've never had a fellow pastor preach to my congregation on giving...just before his offering is received.
I've never had a fellow pastor play games during the altar call like, "Straighten the crooked leg", or "Is anybody here named John, Bill, or Joe? I have word from the Lord from you?"
I've never had a fellow pastor speak to my congregation in an arrogant, condensing tone, when he didn't get the response he wanted.
I've never had a fellow pastor provide me with a "needs list" prior to coming. (specific brand of bottled water, snacks for the hotel room, etc)
I've never had a fellow pastor abandon an altar call, so he could go man his product booth, in the foyer.
I've never had any of that mess with a fellow pastor.
I've had all of that mess with evangelists. |
I would think that after just one encounter with one of these types would have been enough. Preachers such as you describe are an embarrassment to the church and should never be allowed access to your pulpit. Why would you not make it very clear to any future Evangelists that there are certain things that will not be tolerated, and at the first infraction the service is over?
It has been my observation through the years that many people claiming to be an Evangelist forget that they are a guest, and as such should respect both the man of God and the house of God.
_________________
“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/18/18 2:30 pm
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FLRon |
So to wrap this up, it would seem that nothing much has changed in the past 40 years concerning the use of pastors or Evangelists. If anything, the use of a pastor to preach a revival or special service has increased.
It’s a shame however, because an Evangelist brings something to the church that is still needed, that being a fresh perspective and another set of eyes. Of course, the flip side of that is that there are pastors who consider this to be “rocking the boatâ€.
A common theme I’ve heard is this concern that somehow an Evangelist is going to come in and tear up your church and the pastor is going to be left to repair the damage. As I made the point earlier, we are to know them that labor among us, meaning we bear some responsibility in what is said or done.
I will also say this, an Evangelist is often used of God to reveal things or bring things to light that have been left to simmer,hidden from scrutiny. This of course makes pastors uncomfortable, which is understandable. It’s much easier to let sleeping dogs lie, but I would argue that it’s not the best course of action.
Enjoyed the input. Thank you.
_________________
“Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 767
3/18/18 2:42 pm
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