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 Baptist church? Me? |
Resident Skeptic |
In November 2016 we were forced to move in with my father. He lives in a rural area, but churches abound. Within a 3 mile radius there is an AG anda CoG. Long story short, they both are horrible. The only other viable choice in a Southern Baptist church. Interestingly, my Great-Grandfather started this church as a layman in the 1850's. They run about 175 on Sunday Morning. A new pastor was sworn in about 6 months ago. He is 30 years old and formerly pastored in Alabama. We have been visiting this church since we moved in with my dad. There is a "Bapticostal" style to the place as half the members are displaced Pentecostals. Overall, I'd say the pastor's perception of Pentecostalism is negative, this due mainly to the Baptist tendency to lump all Pentecostal/Charismatics together.
Long story short, the pastor is really trying to persuade us to join. He knows I will be finishing school in May of 2019 and likely will leave the area when I find a job. That does not matter to him. We are very tired of not having a church family. No matter where I attend, there will always be some doctrinal point I don't agree with. That always has been the case, but I keep my views to myself on non-essential issues. The pastor has shown us great kindness and seems to want to make me his unofficial assistant!
There are many good reasons we should join this church. My kids love it. I have historical ties there. I see it as a good learning experience as well. For me, EVERYTHING is research! haha It drives my wife nuts! But I am unconvinced still. Some of my hesitation, I'm sure, is based on my own personal and financial struggles that we have endured these past years. My prayer life is good. i study the word daily. But I'm amassing more student loan debt than I ever intended. In the last 2 years my credit score went from 540 to 720, only to crash to 580 last month. I am having trouble with a sibling who thinks she somehow is entitled to my father's estate when he dies and treats me and my family badly. Her cat literally destroyed my laptop last month by urinating on it, and my sister has never offered to pay me for it. She does not live with my dad, but her 4 cats do, and my dad pays for all of their food and vet bills. He practically supports her. This has been going on for years. Two weeks ago, a joint disorder in my left knee I was diagnosed with in 1984 resurfaced. I can barely walk. No insurance. Because we sold my mom's place less than 2 years ago, we will most likely lose our kids' state insurance at the end of this month.
Yes, I want to join this church, even if only temporarily, and through being a humble servant, be a good example and testimony to these Baptists of what a Pentecostal is like. But everything I just mentioned weighs heavy on my heart.
As always, I appreciate your prayers.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/12/18 9:25 am
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Dave Dorsey |
If he's preaching the Word of God on the essentials and your kids are engaged and hearing the gospel and growing in the faith, it's hard to see how you could go wrong.
You might want to ask him about his views on continuationism vs. cessationism. Many baptists nowadays are open to or affirming of continuationism. They are just wary of Pentecostalism in general because of its association with hypercharismaticism, as you observed. If he affirms continuationism, you may find there is actually not a lot of difference between you and him on that issue. And if there is, unity on the essentials and a family that is growing in the faith should always be the first focus, in my opinion.
So long as he's preaching the gospel of the triune God, I'd say you're in a good place. I'll pray for you. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
3/12/18 9:30 am
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Old Time Country Preacher |
| Hey, I druther deal with cessationism than grave suckin/angel feathers/gold dust. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15564
3/12/18 10:55 am
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Resident Skeptic |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Hey, I druther deal with cessationism than grave suckin/angel feathers/gold dust. |
Isn't it sad that it has come to this? 
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/12/18 11:25 am
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Patrick Harris |
I'll think it will be just fine.
You know my own experience attending a UPC church for 2 years and the wonderful fellowship I felt there despite our differences.
I also, in the past, have been able to pastor a Baptist fellowship with those over me knowing fully well that I'm very Pentecostal at heart.
So I think sometimes there is enough in common to make things work and allow us all to grow.
Prayers for you during this time. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1323
3/12/18 2:15 pm
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Cojak |
| Patrick Harris wrote: | I'll think it will be just fine.
You know my own experience attending a UPC church for 2 years and the wonderful fellowship I felt there despite our differences.
I also, in the past, have been able to pastor a Baptist fellowship with those over me knowing fully well that I'm very Pentecostal at heart.
So I think sometimes there is enough in common to make things work and allow us all to grow.
Prayers for you during this time. |
_________________
Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011
Posts: 24275
3/12/18 11:31 pm
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| no offense intended |
wayne |
| but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1274
3/13/18 10:21 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
Resident Skeptic |
| wayne wrote: | | but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
I feel the same way. I do not see how I would benefit any church at this point.
I really am trying. After I finish school; things will look up, I hope. But I cannot wait another year. Now I can barely walk due to a knee injury. 
I've never felt so useless as I do right now.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/13/18 2:15 pm
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| Re: no offense intended |
Resident Skeptic |
| wayne wrote: | | but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
Brother, I have to come back to your comment. In the past 5-6 years, you are the FIRST, pastor or laity to make such a comment to me. I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. They just cannot seem to be able to understand how low I feel as a man not adequately providing for my own. I have always THOUGHT what you stated, but seemed to be the only one with that opinion.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/13/18 2:37 pm
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| Re: no offense intended |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: |
I've never felt so useless as I do right now. |
Well you ain't useless, RS. You're bein challenged, fought an even tested. Look man, you ain't useless. This is a test. It is only a test. An you gonna pull through. Yep, family first. If I had to go to a Baptist church cause no others was readily available, I would go. Hang in there. Hang tough. You gonna make it. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15564
3/13/18 3:01 pm
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| Re: no offense intended |
Resident Skeptic |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: |
I've never felt so useless as I do right now. |
Well you ain't useless, RS. You're bein challenged, fought an even tested. Look man, you ain't useless. This is a test. It is only a test. An you gonna pull through. Yep, family first. If I had to go to a Baptist church cause no others was readily available, I would go. Hang in there. Hang tough. You gonna make it. |
Thank you, brother.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/13/18 6:37 pm
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| Re: no offense intended |
wayne |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | wayne wrote: | | but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
Brother, I have to come back to your comment. In the past 5-6 years, you are the FIRST, pastor or laity to make such a comment to me. I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. They just cannot seem to be able to understand how low I feel as a man not adequately providing for my own. I have always THOUGHT what you stated, but seemed to be the only one with that opinion. |
how much more schooling do you have? how much time do you spend on school work? Is this an on-line degree? what will you have a degree in. |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1274
3/14/18 8:20 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
wayne |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | wayne wrote: | | but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
Brother, I have to come back to your comment. In the past 5-6 years, you are the FIRST, pastor or laity to make such a comment to me. I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. They just cannot seem to be able to understand how low I feel as a man not adequately providing for my own. I have always THOUGHT what you stated, but seemed to be the only one with that opinion. |
you will be happier as a man if, your family is doing better financially and you can get back into your own home. I'm sure there is some sort of work you can do with a bad knee. Citibank, RDI collections are some companies in our area that have tons of sit down jobs. My son works in the college library to make money.
we tell our church members that God loves a cheerful giver and if you are not giving with a cheerful heart, keep the money in your pocket. I know that will get me in trouble with a lot of pastors but, you have a family to take care of and you have your mental state to get in order.
Praying for you my friend! |
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1274
3/14/18 8:27 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
Dave Dorsey |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. |
This is tragic, and I'm really sorry to hear it. This is the fruit of the theology that you can give and serve your way out of suffering. Instead of coming along side our brothers and sisters and supporting them, loving them, praying for them, helping them, and encouraging them -- we just wonder why they're not following the magic formulas that will get them out of their troubles. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
3/14/18 9:16 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
Resident Skeptic |
| wayne wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | wayne wrote: | | but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church. |
Brother, I have to come back to your comment. In the past 5-6 years, you are the FIRST, pastor or laity to make such a comment to me. I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. They just cannot seem to be able to understand how low I feel as a man not adequately providing for my own. I have always THOUGHT what you stated, but seemed to be the only one with that opinion. |
how much more schooling do you have? how much time do you spend on school work? Is this an on-line degree? what will you have a degree in. |
I average 5 hours a day, 7 days a week on school work. I will graduate in May of 2019. My Masters will be in history.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/16/18 9:25 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
Resident Skeptic |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. |
This is tragic, and I'm really sorry to hear it. This is the fruit of the theology that you can give and serve your way out of suffering. Instead of coming along side our brothers and sisters and supporting them, loving them, praying for them, helping them, and encouraging them -- we just wonder why they're not following the magic formulas that will get them out of their troubles. |
Yes, this has been an eye opening experience as to what the majority of pastors and churches seem to believe about financial trials. Like you said, it's "give and serve your way out of suffering".
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
3/16/18 9:26 am
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| Re: no offense intended |
Preacher777 |
[quote="wayne"][quote="Resident Skeptic"][quote="wayne"]but the Baptist church is a secondary need. Sounds to me like you need to tend to your financial state first. God, Family and then Church.[/quote]
Brother, I have to come back to your comment. In the past 5-6 years, you are the FIRST, pastor or laity to make such a comment to me. I have tried hard the past few years to make pastors and others understand what this is doing to me psychologically, but nobody gets it. They just encourage me to forget it all and just "stay busy in the church", but then don't understand why I don't give much in the offering. They just cannot seem to be able to understand how low I feel as a man not adequately providing for my own. I have always THOUGHT what you stated, but seemed to be the only one with that opinion.[/quote]
how much more schooling do you have? how much time do you spend on school work? Is this an on-line degree? what will you have a degree in.[/quote]
Resident Skeptic, know that God sees your heart and pain. You worked for many years in the ministry without sufficient pay, benefits, honor and glory. WHAT A WASTE IF THE REWARDS OF THIS LIFE WERE THE END OF IT ALL. Mt. 16:27: For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds. God wants to take care of you and your family's needs on this earth but that pales compared to His eternal rewards.
I second Wayne's great advice about taking care of your family. Do keep believing God for His ability to provide for your family and use you in ministry. God wants to take care of you and your family spiritually, emotionally and physically. God still has fine pastors who have His heart and will want to help you as you and your family's needs are met. |
Friendly Face
Posts: 434
3/16/18 1:47 pm
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