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 Imagine what Billy Graham Could Have Done ifn He'd Had Gold Dust, Angel Feathers or Grave Suckin |
Old Time Country Preacher |
215 Million people heard him speak in person, heard the Gospel, an we'll never know how many of em committed to Christ.
But imagine if Gold Dust fell on em in Seoul, SK.
Or if angel feathers fluttered down on em in Romania. Sooonnnnnnn!!!!
Or if he'd just had a crusade at Wigglesworth's grave or Kuhlman's grave, an all of em got to grave suckin?
My, My, My................ |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/3/18 1:19 pm
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Dave Dorsey |
Well Ole Timer, according to Bill Johnson, the gospel must be presented in the context of signs and wonders, or else it is a "different gospel" than the authentic gospel preached in the Bible.
So unfortunately while Billy Graham may have been a convincing speaker, according to the apostolic pillar in Redding, his message, devoid of signs and wonders, was the message of a different gospel.
Johnson, B. (December 11, 2011). The Requirement of Miracles. Lecture. Retrieved from http://www.bethel.tv/watch/1176/the-requirement-of-miracles/2011/12/11 |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
3/3/18 1:32 pm
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Old Time Country Preacher |
Guess at settles it then, Dave. Graham, according to apostle Johnsons teachin, wasted his life.
Last edited by Old Time Country Preacher on 3/3/18 4:23 pm; edited 1 time in total |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/3/18 1:41 pm
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| Re: Imagine what Billy Graham Could Have Done ifn He'd Had Gold Dust, Angel Feathers or Grave Suckin |
Dean Steenburgh |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | 215 Million people heard him speak in person, heard the Gospel, an we'll never know how many of em committed to Christ.
But imagine if Gold Dust fell on em in Seoul, SK.
Or if angel feathers fluttered down on em in Romania. Sooonnnnnnn!!!!
Or if he'd just had a crusade at Wigglesworth's grave or Kuhlman's grave, an all of em got to grave suckin?
My, My, My................ |
This parody won't protect you from speaking evil against your brother if you bother to read James 4:11-12 ...but this IS what you do best!
.
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/3/18 1:47 pm
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| Re: Imagine what Billy Graham Could Have Done ifn He'd Had Gold Dust, Angel Feathers or Grave Suckin |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | 215 Million people heard him speak in person, heard the Gospel, an we'll never know how many of em committed to Christ.
But imagine if Gold Dust fell on em in Seoul, SK.
Or if angel feathers fluttered down on em in Romania. Sooonnnnnnn!!!!
Or if he'd just had a crusade at Wigglesworth's grave or Kuhlman's grave, an all of em got to grave suckin?
My, My, My................ |
This parody won't protect you from speaking evil against your brother if you bother to read James 4:11-12 ...but this IS what you do best!
. |
Ats a good passage, Dean, an very true. But please align it with 1 John 4:1-6 for clarity. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/3/18 4:26 pm
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| Re: Imagine what Billy Graham Could Have Done ifn He'd Had Gold Dust, Angel Feathers or Grave Suckin |
Dean Steenburgh |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | 215 Million people heard him speak in person, heard the Gospel, an we'll never know how many of em committed to Christ.
But imagine if Gold Dust fell on em in Seoul, SK.
Or if angel feathers fluttered down on em in Romania. Sooonnnnnnn!!!!
Or if he'd just had a crusade at Wigglesworth's grave or Kuhlman's grave, an all of em got to grave suckin?
My, My, My................ |
This parody won't protect you from speaking evil against your brother if you bother to read James 4:11-12 ...but this IS what you do best!
. |
Ats a good passage, Dean, an very true. But please align it with 1 John 4:1-6 for clarity. |
Familiar with it but what does that have to do with a Godly church whose leadership leads people to Christ & they are in conformance especially with verses 2-3?
You however seem to have appointed yourself as a judge by applying vs 6 to you & your own personal beliefs.
In fact by your own words its as though you believe you are a judge. (Back to James 4 Old Preacher).
You've been to Cleveland but you've never been to Redding lol.
.
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/3/18 5:01 pm
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| Re: Imagine what Billy Graham Could Have Done ifn He'd Had Gold Dust, Angel Feathers or Grave Suckin |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | 215 Million people heard him speak in person, heard the Gospel, an we'll never know how many of em committed to Christ.
But imagine if Gold Dust fell on em in Seoul, SK.
Or if angel feathers fluttered down on em in Romania. Sooonnnnnnn!!!!
Or if he'd just had a crusade at Wigglesworth's grave or Kuhlman's grave, an all of em got to grave suckin?
My, My, My................ |
This parody won't protect you from speaking evil against your brother if you bother to read James 4:11-12 ...but this IS what you do best!
. |
Ats a good passage, Dean, an very true. But please align it with 1 John 4:1-6 for clarity. |
Familiar with it but what does that have to do with a Godly church whose leadership leads people to Christ & they are in conformance especially with verses 2-3?
You however seem to have appointed yourself as a judge by applying vs 6 to you & your own personal beliefs.
In fact by your own words its as though you believe you are a judge. (Back to James 4 Old Preacher).
You've been to Cleveland but you've never been to Redding lol.
. |
In the words of Tertullian, what does Redding have to do with Cleveland?
OTCP is NO MAN's Judge.
Scripture is EVERY MAN's Judge, an we are told to use it to judge (discern) with/by. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/3/18 5:28 pm
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Dean Steenburgh |
When you basically/intentionally call another pastor a fraud you have already judged him 
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/3/18 6:17 pm
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Old Time Country Preacher |
| Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | When you basically/intentionally call another pastor a fraud you have already judged him |
Seriously, Dean, did OTCP call Johnson a fraud?
Or, did I speak to the practice(s) he encourages/espouses? |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/3/18 8:45 pm
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Dean Steenburgh |
| Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | | Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | When you basically/intentionally call another pastor a fraud you have already judged him |
Seriously, Dean, did OTCP call Johnson a fraud?
Or, did I speak to the practice(s) he encourages/espouses? |
OMG dude ...seriously?
When the very title of your thread invokes the nation's evangelist & then combines sensationalistic stories of a legit Christian pastor, it says fraud by implication in the least of definitions.
By the title alone you intended to solicit comments that would offer opinions that speak of fraudulent integrity related to Pastor Johnson.
Yes, from every angle you have called him a fraud & by no veiled terms to say the least.
If your opinion of him & the Bethel ministry is so negative that you imply fraud & heresy then for the sake of truth own your own statements, implications & opinions.
It's America, you're entitled to be wrong!
And again, you've probably never been there & yet you're an expert ...right?!? 
.
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/3/18 9:59 pm
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| OTCP is the pharisaical fraud here! |
JimmieDavis |
| You frauded a brother. Onewho has labored in the Gospel, preached the Gospel, honored Christ and made room for His Spirit to do things that your religious mind can not embrace. I think a person as defaming and critical of you should be removed from this community. You are a plague. There are no good kinds of plague. |
Friendly Face
Posts: 219
3/4/18 8:45 am
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| Re: OTCP is the pharisaical fraud here! |
Dave Dorsey |
| JimmieDavis wrote: | | You are a plague. There are no good kinds of plague. |
One thing that's always fascinated me is the connection between bad theology and bad character. It is not necessarily a given that people with bad theology will also have bad character -- some are very sincere despite being in error, and I suppose God graciously keeps them. That's true of all of us to an extent, as none of us have perfect theology, and yet God works in us and keeps us.
But, there's also a clear connection in Scripture between the two. We're commanded to judge elders and teachers not only on their doctrine, but also on their character. Good character is the work of Christ as we understand and embrace the true gospel; bad character is the work of sin as we are blinded by falsehood.
The small handful of folks on this forum opposing OTCP, me and others on this topic seem a little sharp, to put it lightly. Lots of questions or accusations about motives and hearts. In the case of your post, outright personal attack. Not a lot of discussing the issues themselves. Not sure why that is, but the character of some of these replies has really stood out to me. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
3/4/18 8:55 am
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UncleJD |
"Billy Graham" - Lyrics by The Swirling Eddies
| Quote: | I don't know about those other guys
There's something in the back of their eyes
But Billy, you're the man who don't use slight of hand
Ain't wearing no disguise
I love you, Billy
I love the simple things you say
And you never seem to get in the way
No one is quite like you
Compassionate and true
"Just as I am," I say
I love you, Billy |
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Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3139
3/4/18 9:37 am
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| Re: OTCP is the pharisaical fraud here! |
Dean Steenburgh |
| Dave Dorsey wrote: | | JimmieDavis wrote: | | You are a plague. There are no good kinds of plague. |
One thing that's always fascinated me is the connection between bad theology and bad character. It is not necessarily a given that people with bad theology will also have bad character -- some are very sincere despite being in error, and I suppose God graciously keeps them. That's true of all of us to an extent, as none of us have perfect theology, and yet God works in us and keeps us.
But, there's also a clear connection in Scripture between the two. We're commanded to judge elders and teachers not only on their doctrine, but also on their character. Good character is the work of Christ as we understand and embrace the true gospel; bad character is the work of sin as we are blinded by falsehood.
The small handful of folks on this forum opposing OTCP, me and others on this topic seem a little sharp, to put it lightly. Lots of questions or accusations about motives and hearts. In the case of your post, outright personal attack. Not a lot of discussing the issues themselves. Not sure why that is, but the character of some of these replies has really stood out to me. |
Again Dave I do believe you're missing the point but I'm not going to accuse you of doing it on purpose.
You & Old Preacher have went 'out of your way' to bark up a tree that isn't even in your yard. You use words like: 'We're commanded to judge elders and teachers not only on their doctrine, but also on their character.'
But the issue is you're not only judging these folks at Bethel but you're going out of your way to make fun of these folks & their ministry.
My daughter is home this weekend & I haven't showed her these post's you guys have, for some reason decided to arbitrarily create, if I did she would be hurt & offended.
Bethel has become her home church since she & Kevin moved to Redding & they love the atmosphere & the spirit of excitement watching people waiting with them in line to go to church.
As I said before & I asked the question, 'have you ever attended a single service in person?' And you both chose to ignore the question.
My feeling is that you & OTCP are looking for a topic that draws a sensational response from others & you wanted to pluck the splinter out of the eye of another preacher.
I do not sense in either of you a genuine spirit of judging the core motivation of Bill Johnson or the Bethel Ministry - I sense a mocking spirit & a motivation to sow discord among others who you want to entice to believe your opinion.
I like you Dave & I like the Old Preacher but when it comes to leveling insults & fraudulent comments at a pastor who teaches Christ crucified, I feel you have stepped over the line.
No 'little sharp' attack on you but no matter what your opinion of Johnson & Bethel are I don't feel as though your threads on the topic are of innocent value.
.
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/4/18 12:10 pm
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| Re: OTCP is the pharisaical fraud here! |
Dave Dorsey |
| Dean Steenburgh wrote: | My feeling is that you & OTCP are looking for a topic that draws a sensational response from others & you wanted to pluck the splinter out of the eye of another preacher.
I do not sense in either of you a genuine spirit of judging the core motivation of Bill Johnson or the Bethel Ministry - I sense a mocking spirit & a motivation to sow discord among others who you want to entice to believe your opinion.
I don't feel as though your threads on the topic are of innocent value. |
Dean, I like you too brother, and for the record, I don't hold the same opinions of you. I have no question in my heart or mind as to your motives, integrity, or decency. I believe you endorse dangerous teaching and are wrong to do so, but I am content to disagree with you as a brother, and do not feel the need to call your motives, intentions, or the nature of your heart into the debate. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 13654
3/4/18 12:25 pm
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| Re: OTCP is the pharisaical fraud here! |
Old Time Country Preacher |
| Dean Steenburgh wrote: | | I do not sense in either of you a genuine spirit of judging the core motivation of Bill Johnson or the Bethel Ministry - I sense a mocking spirit & a motivation to sow discord among others who you want to entice to believe your opinion. |
Dean, in sincerity, some a ma posts in this thread has been a bit light of heart, teasin/jokin an all. Just like I'd tease/joke bout a hillbilly, a democrat or any number a things.
I don't know Bethel/Johnson's motivation. The motivation may be as sincere as the day is long. There may be a sincere effort to seek "more a God." That said, we still gotta deal with the excess, which absolutely ain't biblical, an borders on fruitcake-ishness.
Now, I got all confidence ya daughter/son-in-law is sincere. So lets lay all at aside.
You spoke of the wonderful atmosphere at Bethel. An atmosphere can be created. A good atmosphere don't mean them practices listed in the title a this thread is biblical. |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15566
3/4/18 2:04 pm
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Dean Steenburgh |
I can live with the understanding to agree to disagree.
For the record I've never seen nor heard a single mention at any worship event the notion that there would be any evidence of feathers or gold dust.
Would like to mention that just because things are different at any celebration of worship doesn't mean it had to pass our definition of what worship means.
So to that end we can agree that the worship of God takes many forms.
.
_________________
"Empty nest syndrome is for the birds!"
Email me at: SteenburghDean@gmail.com
Church planters are focused on just one thing ...introducing people to Jesus!
What are you focused on? |
Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia
Posts: 4682
3/4/18 4:47 pm
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