Actscelerate.com Forum Index Actscelerate.com
Open Any Time -- Day or Night
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
r/Actscelerate

For Security, do any of you lock all doors during service times?
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
   Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Message Author
Post For Security, do any of you lock all doors during service times? caseyleejones
And have greeters or ushers open doors for people?

If you lock them down, at what time is that? At the beginning? Before?

THANKS
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11788
12/4/17 2:55 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
We are looking into getting a security camera set up where an usher/doorman can see who’s coming, and buzz them in if they appear safe. This would work to keep a guy carrying a rifle (or who otherwise looks suspicious) out. If someone were to visit our church with a concealed weapon or with a bomb hidden on his person, I don’t know exactly how you can prevent that, realistically.

I'm considering putting a sign near our front door that says, “Not a Gun Free Zone.” Not sure yet how well that would go over.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/4/17 4:35 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post We have 6 cameras trained on our parking areas and 3 main doors. brotherjames
We have never locked our main doors before although we have kids church in a separate building. An armed usher escorts the children from the lobby after worship to the other building and then they are locked in. Panic bars provide emergency egress. We are now installing panic bars on our main entrances and plan now to lock the less used entrance. Our service is 2 hrs and begins at 10 am. At 10:20 We will lock the less used entrance and with signage direct late comers to the other entrance which is guarded and monitored. Hate to do all this but a sign of the times. Anything less might be considered negligence if something ever did happen. Welcome to the end of days. Acts-celerater
Posts: 935
12/4/17 6:54 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
One thing I have been quite surprised at is that some of our oldest members have gotten offended at the very idea of organizing an armed, trained security team from among our congregation. “Why can’t we just trust God? We don’t need guns! Where is our faith?”, they say. One lady even said last Sunday during testimony time, “We don’t need guns! The LORD will take care of us!”

The fact is, our state is open carry, people can obtain a concealed carry license, and guns are not forbidden by state law on church campuses. (If a church wants to be a ‘gun free’ zone, they can do that if they want to, but I definitely am opposed to making us into a ‘come shoot us’ zone).

So my thought is, since we already have the possibility of anyone open carrying or concealed carrying, why not organize and train a security team, so that we can all be on the same page? For just suggesting that we look into forming an armed, trained security team, some are questioning our faith. Good grief.


Last edited by Quiet Wyatt on 12/4/17 11:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/4/17 9:04 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post sheepdogandy
We have several law enforcement officers who carry during our services.

Also, there are others who are armed and capable of handling any situation.

One of our members is the training officer for the Sherriff's department.

We have armed escort for the Children's Church kids.

Closed circuit cameras cover all entrances.

If I shout "lie down" my folks know to fall over on the pew..
_________________
Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor SPWC
Congregational Church of God

www.spwc.church
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 7294
12/4/17 10:14 pm


View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Reply with quote
Post Link
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
I'm considering putting a sign near our front door that says, “Not a Gun Free Zone.” Not sure yet how well that would go over.


How about "Beware of snakes"? Shocked
_________________
Link
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11845
12/5/17 12:56 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
sheepdogandy wrote:
We have several law enforcement officers who carry during our services.

Also, there are others who are armed and capable of handling any situation.

One of our members is the training officer for the Sherriff's department.

We have armed escort for the Children's Church kids.

Closed circuit cameras cover all entrances.

If I shout "lie down" my folks know to fall over on the pew..


Good for y’all, Andy. I have considered hiring an off-duty cop to sit in our parking lot during services. We don’t have any police officers who attend, unfortunately.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/5/17 1:17 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
Link wrote:
Quiet Wyatt wrote:
I'm considering putting a sign near our front door that says, “Not a Gun Free Zone.” Not sure yet how well that would go over.


How about "Beware of snakes"? Shocked


🤓
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/5/17 1:19 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Not locking doors Clint Wills
Homestead has a large military population, and as such there has been a fair amount of discussion on church security since the event in Texas. My message to the people that have asked me questions is that we will do whatever is REASONABLE to insure the safety of the people in the church. I do also remind them that people dying for their faith in Jesus Christ is nothing new.

For me, locking the church doors isn't reasonable. We have taken/are taking measures to insure that our congregants are safe, but locking doors to the church sends a very clear message that we are afraid and that we are unsure about anyone that we don't know.

We are a church first and foremost. Our responsibility is to equip people and lead them closer to Jesus. I believe that we have a responsibility to keep everyone as safe as possible, but we won't compromise the front door experience of the church for it.
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5163
12/6/17 6:18 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post bamaboy
We lock all doors except the front after sunday school is over. We have a separate building for S.S. classes and lock it completely when it's over. Once church starts the only way inside our church is through the front doors where a uniformed police officer can see anyone entering. They are posted at the stairs so they also have to go by them to get to our children's area. The nursery is locked completely with push-bars to exit in an emergency.
We have a security team with 2 "on duty" every week for locking doors and walking the property. The others are situated throughout the congregation to cover the entire room.
Member
Posts: 47
12/13/17 11:05 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Carolyn Smith
I thought it was against the law to lock doors in a public place while it's in use, unless it has the panic release doors. This would be hazardous if there was a fire.
_________________
"More of Him...less of me."
http://twitter.com/camiracle77
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 5903
12/13/17 10:01 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post We Have a Full Security Team FG Minister
Our security team has at least four people on duty at each of our two Sunday services. We have 5-7 people who are carrying a gun in every service; they are asked to sign in. We have 16 cameras that are monitoring each classroom, hallway, and entrance. One security guy is monitoring the cameras at all times. One of our armed men stands next to me every Sunday as I shake hands at the main door. This is all for church services.

During the week, we have all doors locked and to get in, a person must press an intercom button and when they do a camera comes on and records them and I can see them. Either I or my secretary can buzz them in.

For us this is not overkill. We are in a small town of 60,000, but three years ago we had a man park on the lot and sit in his truck for nine minutes (the tape later revealed). I noticed him and watched him. After 9 minutes, he got out of his truck, pulled a hoodie over his head, and came to the door. As he reached for the door handle he saw the camera focused on him. He turned, ran, and got away. We have also had two sex offenders come to our church, but people knew who they were so we monitored them via camera until police could be notified.

We don't live in Mayberry anymore. I encourage every church, large and small, to develop a security plan.
Acts-celerater
Posts: 872
12/14/17 8:35 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Did you see the interview ... Mat
Did you see the interview of the pastor and his wife (not sure of the network) of the church in Texas?

He said, they had an "active shooter plan" and several of the members had concealed carry permits, including himself.

He said, the Sunday of the shooting, none of the members with concealed carry permits were in church, including himself.

I feel there is a rush to make churches "armed-camps" in which members (and pastors) know more about concealed carry laws and guns then they do about living as a child of the King.

We will become what we focus on, and if we are not careful we will think it is God's will to amass an arsenal equal to the Branch Davidian. Marksmanship is no substitute for the Holy Spirit. Should you carry and have an accidental discharge at church, hitting and perhaps killing someone (a child), you will destroy you church, your ministry and the lives of the family effected. You become what you feared.

When I was 13 years old, I was accidentally shot in the leg by a friend. He carries a .22 rifle and as the adult with us was setting targets, my friend loaded a .22 short and put the rifle under his arm. He turn to talk to me and as he did the rifle discharged (he did not think he had his finger on the trigger). The bullet passed through the calf of my right leg and did not hit bone or artery (Praise the Lord). They had to take turns carrying me out of the woods. They took me to Bradley County Hospital there in Cleveland. It just so happened our family doctor (Dr. Proffit) was there and he took me into the ER exam room. First he cleaned the wound (both sides) with a probe, you have to get out the cloth carried in by the bullet. He check the flow of blood (they had put a tourniquet on my leg - belts) and bleeding was light. He then sterilized the wounds by pouring alcohol in both sides - entrance and exit wounds (by this time I was crying for my mother and thought I was going to pass out or throw-up). After he bandage me up and had some x-rays taken, he told me to get up and walk - which, due the pain, I could not.

Now, in retrospective that was not much of a gunshot wound, but when young adults show off their tattoos I show them my gunshot wounds and tell them to go get something their grandmother does not already have. But if you pastor shoot a child accidentally in church, I'm not sure you will ever be redeemable.

Mat
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1972
12/14/17 9:06 am


View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Reply with quote
Post Quiet Wyatt
Since our state (NM) is an open carry state, and since churches are not ‘gun free zones’ here, either, we are in the process of organizing those who do wish to carry concealed in our services. Firearm safety is definitely of utmost importance. Better to be as well prepared as possible. I do not have the money or interest in becoming an armed camp like the Branch Davidians definitely were. If I recall correctly, they had an incredible number of firearms, including something like 300 assault rifles and even had machine guns.

All we are interested in is organizing those of us who do carry, so that we can be all on the same page if something happens. We can’t of course prevent any and all evil contingencies, but prudence would indicate that being as well prepared as possible would be far better than to be unprepared. Protecting the precious lives of the children entrusted to our care is our number one safety priority.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/14/17 10:29 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Old Time Country Preacher
Locked doors?

Where is your faith?
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15559
12/14/17 12:51 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Question About Faith FG Minister
Because we are people of faith, does that mean we are to disengage our brains and throw out common sense? Just wondering. If we follow this line of thinking (have faith - don't lock doors, don't have security teams, don't have cameras), then we should continue with that philosophy. Don't wear seat belts, don't obey speed limits, don't take medicine, don't duck when the bullets start flying etc.

I think faith requires us to use our brains. I doubt Daniel was in the lion's den poking the lions with a stick! Use your brain - take precautions!
Acts-celerater
Posts: 872
12/15/17 8:29 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post I guess you don't carry a spare tire...but by faith caseyleejones
Old Time Country Preacher wrote:
Locked doors?

Where is your faith?


believe God will provide one when you are flat...or do you speak to your tires before driving? Very Happy
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11788
12/15/17 9:01 am


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post If security is the goal at church... Mat
If security is the goal at church than the drive to and from church, along with the dangers of your children being in the proximity of sex offenders is a much higher risk than a active shooter event.

Yes, we should take precautions - background checks, policy regarding the interactions of men and women (now-a-days maybe men with men, etc), adults and children, handling money - and yes, a security plan. The issue to me is the willingness to introduce pistols into a crowded church in the hands of people who have no more training than a Concealed Carry Permit.

Even trained police officers have been know to expend every round in the magazine (upwards of 15) at close range and not hit the suspect with all of them (sometimes the suspect does not even have a gun). Are we really wanting to have untrained people in the church ready to fire on someone with a gun who is firing at them?

I will make this point, what did Jesus say about those who harm children? If in the process of "defending" the church, one of my rounds was to find its way to a child, I'm not sure there would be redemption for me. Much like drinking and driving, when you carry a pistol you choose to carry deadly force. There is no accidental death when a drunk driver kills someone, and their is no accidental death when you fire your weapon in a crowd. I feel you better hit your target and only your target, lest you wear the "millstone".

Mat
Acts Enthusiast
Posts: 1972
12/16/17 12:07 pm


View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Reply with quote
Post Re: If security is the goal at church... Quiet Wyatt
Mat wrote:
If security is the goal at church than the drive to and from church, along with the dangers of your children being in the proximity of sex offenders is a much higher risk than a active shooter event.


It is obviously impossible to totally prevent all possible evil (not even God himself can do that). But for what it’s worth, we do keep up with who the sex offenders are that live in our little town.

Quote:
Are we really wanting to have untrained people in the church ready to fire on someone with a gun who is firing at them?


I am not wanting to have untrained people handling guns anywhere. Beyond encouraging a select few in our church in whose character and stability we have confidence to obtain their concealed carry license, we have been advised by law enforcement that firearm safety and training is of the utmost importance, if one intends to carry. We are planning firearm safety and marksmanship training for our security team beyond just the concealed carry class.

Quote:
I will make this point, what did Jesus say about those who harm children? If in the process of "defending" the church, one of my rounds was to find its way to a child, I'm not sure there would be redemption for me. Much like drinking and driving, when you carry a pistol you choose to carry deadly force. There is no accidental death when a drunk driver kills someone, and their is no accidental death when you fire your weapon in a crowd. I feel you better hit your target and only your target, lest you wear the "millstone".

Mat


It is our goal to protect the children. Your admonition is well taken. Our first line of defense is to secure and monitor the entryways to prevent an active shooter from gaining access in the first place.

Open carry is already the law in New Mexico, where I pastor. Churches are not so-called ‘gun free zones’ by law in our state, either. Knowing that reality, that we cannot realistically stop anybody from carrying in our church building, it seems wisest to have a good plan in place, whereby we do our best to train our security team to be as safe as possible, precisely because we desire to protect our children. And no, I would definitely not think that shooting into a crowd would ever be wise or warranted.

My wife and I have been blessed with five children of our own, all still school-aged. Your argument against responsible gun ownership would hold just as true against home security as it would against church security.

If we had enough money and enough manpower, I suppose we could hire off-duty police officers to watch our facility during service times. In our little town of 2000 population, there generally is only one officer on duty at a time for the whole town.
[Insert Acts Pun Here]
Posts: 12784
12/16/17 12:29 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Post Re: If security is the goal at church... Old Time Country Preacher
Mat wrote:
The issue to me is the willingness to introduce pistols into a crowded church in the hands of people who have no more training than a Concealed Carry Permit.


If just ONE such person had been in the church in Texas, Charleston, etc., think a the lives that coulda been saved. Even the US Army has collateral damage when engaging the enemy. Given the above and the alternative of a shooter masacerin folk, bring the CCP's in.

Oops, btw, yep, we got a armed security team at OTCP International Ministry.
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 15559
12/16/17 5:10 pm


View user's profile Send private message
Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Actscelerate.com Forum Index -> Acts-Celerate Post new topic   Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Acts-celerate Terms of Use | Acts-celerate Policy
Contact the Administrator.


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group :: Spelling by SpellingCow.