Actscelerate.com

Ernie Long

Another music/worship question

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1050 **6/13/17 8:20 am**

How can you get a congregation to worship without having to do a lot of encouraging?

We sing Redback and some contemporary songs. Our church is mostly 65 and older. Regardless of the song, regardless who is singing the song... they sit or stand (for a very few moments) and will not move, not always, but 90% of the time they will not sing unless encouraged to do so. These are physically fit and active people for their age, until it comes to worship in church.

I know people worship in different ways, but imitating a stick figure can not be consider worship by any stretch of the imagination.

UncleJD

Re: Another music/worship question

Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere Posts: 3138 **6/13/17 10:14 am**

Nature Boy Florida

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 **6/13/17 10:27 am**

If you want them to sing - why don't you lead them in singing? or Why don't you pick songs that are easy to sing?

I have come to the conclusion that most services don't really care if I sing - the music has the volume turned up loud enough - that even if I did sing - no one could hear me - including myself.

Or we turn the lights off - which makes me sleepy.

Or we sing very wordy songs - which by the time I figure out the song - we are off to the next one - usually really slow - again which makes me sleepy.

I would rather stand there in the awesome presence of the one singing so beautifully and picture being in the presence of Hillsong or Michael W Smith...which I assume is what they want when the lights go dim - and the spotlights come on them.

People sing with "Take me out to the ballgame" because they usually have a Harey Carey directing them or a bouncing hot dog over the correct word on the big screen when it is time to sing that word.

Perhaps a bouncing cross over the right word would work. At least they would know they were supposed to sing. Twisted Evil

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FLRon

Re: Another music/worship question

Acts-celerater Posts: 767 **6/13/17 11:27 am**

Aaron Scott

Some thoughts...

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6032 **6/13/17 11:33 am**

I'm not old, but I don't like standing up for 45 minutes to "show" that I am worshiping. I may stand spontaneously and worship, but at some point, I'm ready to sit back down and worship from that angle. A person can worship sitting down--and it can be a noticeable thing. But at some point, I get so tired of standing--or so angry about feeling like I HAVE to stand--that, yeah, I can stop worshiping and hope that the worship leader is hit be an asteroid mid-song. (OK, not really, but you get the idea.)

A song set typically has to "fit" the church's personality. If they sing ONLY redback and you come in with the latest Lincoln Brewster, you're probably going to get the CLAANG thing (Cows Looking At A New Gate).

Sadly, the reverse is pretty much true, too, since many younger people have seldom or never even heard some of the songs that used to be Church of God classics (both redback and convention books). BTW, with Tim Hill in leadership, maybe he can push some buttons and get Lee University (using great choirs and many church folks) to put together a collection of ALL (or most) of the redback hymns...AND, perhaps, the Top 50 convention songs of all times that we published for Campmeetings, etc. If nothing else, it would serve as a kind of auditory historical marker for our movement.

Just like concerts, I think that those who stand up in FRONT of me, blocking my view, should be sent to eternal torment...well, at least an hour of it...for purchasing SEATS that they apparently are NOT going to use, nor are going to allow ME to use them. Yes, when there is a standing ovation or time of standing worship, fine. But when I go to church and I HAVE to stand for 45 minutes in order to even see the service, I am almost certainly not going to be in a very worshipful mood--in fact, I'm probably going to have to ask forgiveness for some thoughts. And, if I know what kind of car the people who blocked my view are driving, I might even have to ask forgiveness for keying their car. (Yes, I'm joking, right?)

Tell me that I am not the only person who feels this way!!!

Nature Boy Florida

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 **6/13/17 11:40 am**

Aaron - some professional help would do you good.

The state is sending a wagon to pick you up.

Go outside and wait for it.
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Aaron Scott

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6032 **6/13/17 2:43 pm**

c6thplayer1

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6385 **6/13/17 3:44 pm**

brotherjames

Ernie

Acts-celerater Posts: 935 **6/13/17 5:23 pm**

Your problem is a problem for many churches. It is not an age thing per se although it is part of your problem. If you want people to be more vocal, more passionate in their worship you need to teach them about why they need to. Praise and worship is in fact warfare. Read ps 149, isa 30 :27-32 and many more psalms and scriptures indicate a spiritual warfare component to praise. God sits enthroned on the praises of israel. He inhabits our praises. Teach your people about this. Teach them that as they praise, God moves on their behalf. If you want more material, I have just finished a series on Wed nite about the worship God wants and the power of praise. Pm me and I will email it to you if u like. If you want more militant worship from your people give them some reasons to be more militant. Style is just preference. I don't sing hymns much any more but that doesn't matter. It is worship in spirit and truth that counts. Be blessed

Carolyn Smith

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 5909 **6/13/17 6:50 pm**

Based on what I'm reading here & have seen elsewhere, we have two different trains of thoughts on praise and worship:

1) Redback or it ain't holy. If you ain't gonna sing Redback, don't expect me to sing along. If you do Redback or a couple of Southern Gospel hymns, I might wave my hanky and sing along.

2) Contemporary to the max. This features songs only a select few can sing, and we don't really want the congregation singing anyhow. Y'all just listen to us and enjoy the guitar solos and we'll be done in a bit.

Personally, I think a blend is the best bet, but that usually depends on the church. I can live without the guitar solos, but if you want me to sing along, sing songs I know, love, and understand.

If you want people to worship, model it for them. YOU worship, as the pastor, as the praise leader. Don't focus on the congregation (though you have to know if they are with you or are engaged), but put your focus on the Lord and worship Him. When they see you caught up in His presence and adoring Him, maybe it will look so good to them, they will forget about themselves and focus on Him a while. Isn't that part of why we came to church, anyhow?

Also, please don't fuss at the congregation during praise and worship & tell them they look like they've been drinking pickle juice. This is not found to be effective.
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Cojak

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24276 **6/13/17 9:12 pm**

Imma agree with Aaron (mostly cept the keying the car. flat tire is better! LOL yep that too is a joke)

It always bothered me when I heard, "Can't you stand 45 minutes for the LORD?"

Course I could. For the Lord I would try to stand for the rest of my life. But I don't think I will stand that long just to satisfy someone's idea that is WORSHIP!

Worship (style or ways) is known to the one worshiping, I praise God for that. We limit our congregations and churches by attempting to force feed something not necessarily scriptural and chide those that do not get on the bus as 'an anchor to the ship of Zion.' Wink

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Methocostal

Friendly Face Posts: 496 **6/14/17 4:26 pm**

I get what you are saying. Some people will claim that with blended you make everyone mad Smile

Personally, I think it is a reasonable compromise.

However, please listen to my opinion. People "worship" in different ways! I have sung as a soloist and in quartets at hundreds of venues with all denominations. I can remember one time in particular where I just thought the person in the second row was downright mad and thought I was awful. Afterward, he came to me and said what a wonderful blessing I was. I really believe he was serious. If he was being sarcastic, it sure went over my head. I sang with a quartet at a Church that was "dead". To our surprise, the offering was tremendous with one man giving $400.

For those of you that have been raised Pentecostal and rarely if ever attended more traditional Churches, it becomes engrained that if people aren't visibly "worshipping", they must be dead. While that may be true in cases, that shouldn't be a blanket statement.

I am adamantly opposed to trying to generate a Sunday Morning Pep Rally (an unfinished song I wrote by the way). If we "enthuse" people to "worship", are they truly worshipping? Or is it just an "emotional religion" (another song I wrote). Don't get me wrong, I understand true worship and God inspired enthusiasm and worship. But, simply guilting people into worshipping as you think they should worship (and I'm not directing this to you Car0lyn) is not effective, IMO.

I realize the original poster was coming from the standpoint of a Pentecostal Church (rather than traditional churches), but I think the point remains. My father was a hell fire brimstone huffing, puffing preacher typical of the 1940's to 60's when he preached, but my mother rarely displayed open emotion, yet she was also spirit filled. She had been raised Church of Christ and I suppose that toned down emotion may have influenced her. My dad's mother was a member of the COG from the early 1910's. People worship in different ways.

If you truly want worship, get them to pray and fast so their heart is in the right condition and they will worship as God intends them to worship.

c6thplayer1

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6385 **6/14/17 4:28 pm**

Cojak

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24276 **6/14/17 9:45 pm**

Okay, I have a kin-person who is a preacher. Once he gets 'nointed, I CAN not understand what he says. I casually mentioned this once and he said, "God gives it to me so fast I cannot slow down!" I just mentioned, that several of the people I knew could not understudy him, I just questioned, "If God is giving it surely he wants the congregation to know what it is!"

On the same vein, during a song in a recent service folks were shouting all over the place, we did not know the song. My wife who hears well, said I tried to understand the words, but the amps were so loud the words blurred. Of course I told her the amps were designed by C6th on Acts!.

WORDS, IF THEY ARE TO MEAN ANYTHING, SHOULD BE UNDERSTOOD, PREACHING OR SINGING! Cool

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Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
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Cojak

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24276 **6/14/17 9:48 pm**

Tom Sterbens

Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia Posts: 4507 **6/15/17 6:56 am**

First - the original post is a great question and a transparent question and one many of us have faced (or will face).

Very often people don't know "why" they worship the way they are called to worship - at least they don't why from a biblical standpoint.
Do we know why we sing?
Do we know why we lift our hands?
Do we know why we dance before the Lord?
Do we know why we lift our voice in a shout of praise?
Do we know why we pray...why we kneel...why we share in the table of the Lord...why we baptize in water...why we lay hands on the sick??? (on and on...)

Very often people don't know why we are called to do certain physical expressions of worship...and if we don't know why we do them (from a biblical basis), then doing them - or in the case of the original post, NOT doing them, simply becomes one opinion versus another. Or in the case of many Pentecostal worshipers, we do it if we feel it..in which case our worship is attenuated by our feelings.

One short answer/suggestion to the original post/question is: teach them and model it DURING the time of worship in song. Take several weeks and make the music-worship time an interactive preaching occasion.

Very often in our churches we have reduced worship in music to a time for creating psycho-social proximity to one another - as opposed to enjoining ourselves in a spiritual dynamic that transcends two worlds (the seen and unseen). And unfortunately that has been modeled in my own Pentecostal heritage in my lifetime - what I mean is, the pastor/preacher being disengaged from worship until it is time for them to preach. What does is indirectly reinforce the notion that everything prior to the preaching is simply social preamble.

A fascinating consistency among the elderly (referenced in the original post) is that they are at a place in life where they don't have time for going through the motions of anything. If it really matters then they are all in - if not, they have already spent a lifetime going through the motions for the sake of meaningless agenda.

Last: my response is in no way an indictment toward anyone - and certainly not the original poster.

Nature Boy Florida

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 **6/15/17 7:45 am**

Tom,

Have you preached a series regarding worship?

If so , what are the dates of said sermon series so we can go to your website and watch.

I could obviously use a refresher course.
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today!

Ernie Long

After reading my original post

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1050 **6/15/17 9:46 am**

I made it seem like I pastor zombies. We do have a few that will raise their hands and they do sing along.

God called me a worshiper before He called me a pastor and I worship Him as though no one is around me, because He has done so much for me. My wife nor I have ever gotten onto our people for the way they worship or not.

I'm not looking or asking anyone to worship like I do, but I have to wonder why after someone testifies of what the Lord has done for them during the week, that they will sit as soon as worship begins and be more of a spectator than a participator.

Tom Sterbens

Golf Cart Mafia Capo Famiglia Posts: 4507 **6/15/17 10:29 am**

Nature Boy Florida

Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 **6/15/17 10:35 am**

Thanks Tom.
Very enlightening.

Question - do you not include the music portion because no one's music sounds as good as live on the streaming services - or recorded and played back (not sure why - but it is a fact) - or because of copyright issues?
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today!