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 The Great Debate? Can a person be gay and also be a Christian? If so, must they remain celibate? (L) |
doyle |
http://www.gaychristian.net/greatdebate.php
Even among those who claim to be gay and also Christian, there is what is known as "The Great Debate." Must a person who claims to be gay and also
Christian, remain celibate?
That issue is debated in the link above by two gay men, both who claim to be Christians, but differ on whether they must remain celibate or not.
Our bringing this link before viewers is not an endorsement of any kind. However, since there is now coming more and more pressure on pastors and churches about the issue, it was felt some of this material may be helpful.
Doyle
_________________
The largest room in the world is the room for improvement. |
Acts-celerate Owner
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4/15/16 4:20 pm
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| Whether we like it or not ; |
c6thplayer1 |
15That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
John 5:24New International Version (NIV)
24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
4/15/16 4:33 pm
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| Are you kidding me? |
brotherjames |
This is why musicians shouldn't be pastors. Their brains can't handle any truth except chords and key changes.
1 Cor. 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
Think that about says it all. |
Acts-celerater
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4/15/16 6:33 pm
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| Deleted double post sorry |
brotherjames |
| .. |
Acts-celerater
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4/15/16 6:34 pm
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| Re: Are you kidding me? |
c6thplayer1 |
| brotherjames wrote: | This is why musicians shouldn't be pastors. Their brains can't handle any truth except chords and key changes.
1 Cor. 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
Think that about says it all. |
Keep your hat on .. I just wanted to see who took the bait.. and sometimes my brain does wander ...  |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
4/15/16 9:26 pm
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| No kidding. |
bradfreeman |
| brotherjames wrote: | This is why musicians shouldn't be pastors. Their brains can't handle any truth except chords and key changes.
1 Cor. 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
Think that about says it all. |
That may say it all if that's all you say or see.
That may say it all if you don't understand what makes someone righteous OR unrighteous.
There are only 2 kinds of people in the world...the righteous and the unrighteous.
The righteous are those who believe. The unrighteous are those who do not believe.
You don't "inherit" based on perfect behavior, you "inherit" based on birth.
The righteous are "born again" in Christ and are the children and heirs of God (Rom. 8;16,17).
The unrighteous are born in Adam, are fathered by Satan (John 8:43-45) because they cannot hear and do not believe.
The righteous are not judged. The unrighteous are judged and better not be lawless.
The righteous have already inherited the kingdom (Col. 1:13). The unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom.
The righteous know Him and will have their lawless deeds remembered no more (Heb. 8:11, 12). The unrighteous do not know Him and will see their lawlessness separate them from Him (Mat. 7:23).
You can be righteous despite the fact that you are "ungodly" (Rom. 4:5), "weak" (1 Cor. 1:26-31), "foolish" (1 Cor. 1:26-31), "a sinner" (Luke 18:14), sleeping with prostitutes (1 Cor. 6:15), practicing "immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire...greed...idolatry...anger, wrath, malice, slander... abusive speech" and lying (Col. 3:5-9).
You can be unrighteous despite the fact that you fast twice a week, pay tithes of all you have, thank God, go to church, are not a swindler, unjust an adulterer (Luke 18:11,12), know the Bible extremely well, are zealous for God and blameless when it comes to your lifestyle (Phil. 3:3-9).
Our righteousness is not based on our behavior - good or bad.
Our unrighteousness is not based on our behavior - good or bad.
Rom. 5:19 For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.
We are righteous, holy and redeemed because of the obedience of Jesus. Our obedience is to believe that. (Rom. 10:16,17)
We are unrighteous, condemned and judged because of the disobedience of Adam. Our disobedience is unbelief. (Heb. 3:18,19)
It's simply a matter of faith.
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. 18 He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
To base anyone's life, righteousness, blessing, favor and confidence before God on their ability to keep a set of religious rules (even a great one), behavior or heritage or wisdom or strength is to continue to operate in the flesh, in the knowledge of good and evil and in a system where there is none righteous, no not one.
Christ ended the whole system where we seek to establish our own righteousness by keeping rules.
Rom. 10:3 For not knowing about God’s righteousness and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
Under that system:
No one can be perfect (Mat. 5:48 ).
No one can finish the tower (Luke 14:26-32).
No one can take the kingdom by force (Mat 11:12).
No one can pay the debt (Mat 18:25).
We are saved by grace, through faith, not of works...period. Eph. 2:8,9
He makes us perfect (Heb. 10:14; Heb. 12:23)
He sits us in Heaven (Eph. 2:3-6).
He gives us the kingdom (Luke 12:32).
He cancels our debt (Rom. 4:4-8; Heb. 9:26; Heb. 10:10)
Righteousness is a gift He freely gives to all who believe. It is never based on our strength or lifestyle or wisdom. And if you're looking for evidence that there's been a new birth, look for love (John 13:35; John 15:8; Gal. 5:22; 1 John 3:23).
The proof is love.
The fruit is love.
"Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God." 1 Jn. 4:7
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/
Last edited by bradfreeman on 4/16/16 6:41 am; edited 1 time in total |
Acts-dicted
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4/16/16 6:30 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
Resident Skeptic |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | 15That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
John 5:24New International Version (NIV)
24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. |
In context, John 3:16 was referring to the coming new birth of the Spirit mentioned in verses 3-5 that would be made available after Christ was exalted.
In verse 15, Jesus states that in order for this new birth to be a possibility, he would have to be lifted up as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness. In verse 16 he mentions that we are perishing, just as those being bit by the serpents were perishing.
Unless we repent of what is causing God's wrath to be kindled against us and thus causing us to perish, we cannot claim the promise of John 3:16.
Verses 15-16 are a continuation of the subject of verses 3-5. Jesus came to give a new birth of the Spirit that would bring forgiveness for our unlawful acts and supernatural power to overcome them, giving us a new nature that wants to cast away every sinful act.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
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4/16/16 6:34 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
bradfreeman |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | c6thplayer1 wrote: | 15That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
John 5:24New International Version (NIV)
24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. |
In context, John 3:16 was referring to the coming new birth of the Spirit mentioned in verses 3-5 that would be made available after Christ was exalted.
In verse 15, Jesus states that in order for this new birth to be a possibility, he would have to be lifted up as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness. In verse 16 he mentions that we are perishing, just as those being bit by the serpents were perishing.
Unless we repent of what is causing God's wrath to be kindled against us and thus causing us to perish, we cannot claim the promise of John 3:16.
Verses 15-16 are a continuation of the subject of verses 3-5. Jesus came to give a new birth of the Spirit that would bring forgiveness for our unlawful acts and supernatural power to overcome them, giving us a new nature that wants to cast away every sinful act. |
I agree.
In context, Jesus is telling Nicodemus that he must experience a new birth, one where you don't find your identity in your heritage (you don't know where it comes from) and your earthly destiny (you don't know where you're going).
What Nicodemus and the Jews in Numbers 21 needed to repent from was their determination to live under a system where they die from the poison in the snake's mouth and are cursed by earning their bread by the sweat of their brow and reject the bread from Heaven, God's free gift of life - Jesus (John 6:33-35).
Num 21:5 The people spoke against God and Moses, “Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and we loathe this miserable food.”
Their repentance consisted of seeing that whole serpent system brought to an end on the pole. That's when the poison and death of that system lost it's power.
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
4/16/16 7:00 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
Resident Skeptic |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | c6thplayer1 wrote: | 15That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
John 5:24New International Version (NIV)
24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. |
In context, John 3:16 was referring to the coming new birth of the Spirit mentioned in verses 3-5 that would be made available after Christ was exalted.
In verse 15, Jesus states that in order for this new birth to be a possibility, he would have to be lifted up as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness. In verse 16 he mentions that we are perishing, just as those being bit by the serpents were perishing.
Unless we repent of what is causing God's wrath to be kindled against us and thus causing us to perish, we cannot claim the promise of John 3:16.
Verses 15-16 are a continuation of the subject of verses 3-5. Jesus came to give a new birth of the Spirit that would bring forgiveness for our unlawful acts and supernatural power to overcome them, giving us a new nature that wants to cast away every sinful act. |
In context, Jesus is telling Nicodemus that he must experience a new birth, one where you don't find your identity in your heritage (you don't know where it comes from) and your earthly destiny (you don't know where you're going).
What Nicodemus and the Jews in Numbers 21 needed to repent from was their determination to live under a system where they die from the poison in the snake's mouth and are cursed by earning their bread by the sweat of their brow and reject the bread from Heaven, God's free gift of life - Jesus (John 6:33-35).
Num 21:5 The people spoke against God and Moses, “Why have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness? For there is no food and no water, and we loathe this miserable food.”
Their repentance consisted of seeing that whole serpent system brought to an end on the pole. That's when the poison and death of that system lost it's power. |
The people in the wilderness were perishing for their rebellion against God. We too are perishing for our rebellion against God (verse 16). This is why Jesus used this analogy, to show Nicodemus that his identity as a good Pharisee and Jew would not justify him in the sight of God. In God's eyes he was no better than those of Moses' time that God's wrath through the serpents was being poured out on. The remedy would be a new birth/baptism of the Spirit of God that would be made available after Jesus was lifted up at Calvary.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
4/16/16 7:07 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
bradfreeman |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | The people in the wilderness were perishing for their rebellion against God. We too are perishing for our rebellion against God (verse 16). This is why Jesus used this analogy, to show Nicodemus that his identity as a good Pharisee and Jew would not justify him in the sight of God. In God's eyes he was no better than those of Moses' time that God's wrath through the serpents was being poured out on. The remedy would be a new birth/baptism of the Spirit of God that would be made available after Jesus was lifted up at Calvary. |
I agree.
Heb. 3:12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end, 15 while it is said,
“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts, as when they provoked Me.”
16 For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? 17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.
Heb. 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“As I swore in My wrath,
They shall not enter My rest,”
although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.
It really isn't complicated.
Faith is the obedience that makes you righteous and gets you in.
Unbelief is the disobedience that leaves you unrighteous and keeps you out.
John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
What left them under wrath in the wilderness? The disobedience of unbelief.
What gets us into eternal life and rest? The obedience of faith.
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
4/16/16 7:40 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
Resident Skeptic |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | The people in the wilderness were perishing for their rebellion against God. We too are perishing for our rebellion against God (verse 16). This is why Jesus used this analogy, to show Nicodemus that his identity as a good Pharisee and Jew would not justify him in the sight of God. In God's eyes he was no better than those of Moses' time that God's wrath through the serpents was being poured out on. The remedy would be a new birth/baptism of the Spirit of God that would be made available after Jesus was lifted up at Calvary. |
I agree.
Heb. 3:12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end, 15 while it is said,
“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts, as when they provoked Me.”
16 For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? 17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.
Heb. 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“As I swore in My wrath,
They shall not enter My rest,”
although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.
It really isn't complicated.
Faith is the obedience that makes you righteous and gets you in.
Unbelief is the disobedience that leaves you unrighteous and keeps you out.
John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
What left them under wrath in the wilderness? The disobedience of unbelief.
What gets us into eternal life and rest? The obedience of faith. |
Yes, he who "has the Son" has eternal life. And how does one "have the Son"?....
| Quote: | | God has sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (Gal. 4:6) |
| Quote: | | And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. (Romans 8:9) |
| Quote: | | 38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2:38) |
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
4/16/16 7:56 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
bradfreeman |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | The people in the wilderness were perishing for their rebellion against God. We too are perishing for our rebellion against God (verse 16). This is why Jesus used this analogy, to show Nicodemus that his identity as a good Pharisee and Jew would not justify him in the sight of God. In God's eyes he was no better than those of Moses' time that God's wrath through the serpents was being poured out on. The remedy would be a new birth/baptism of the Spirit of God that would be made available after Jesus was lifted up at Calvary. |
I agree.
Heb. 3:12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end, 15 while it is said,
“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts, as when they provoked Me.”
16 For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? 17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.
Heb. 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“As I swore in My wrath,
They shall not enter My rest,”
although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.
It really isn't complicated.
Faith is the obedience that makes you righteous and gets you in.
Unbelief is the disobedience that leaves you unrighteous and keeps you out.
John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
What left them under wrath in the wilderness? The disobedience of unbelief.
What gets us into eternal life and rest? The obedience of faith. |
Yes, he who "has the Son" has eternal life. And how does one "have the Son"?....
| Quote: | | God has sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (Gal. 4:6) |
| Quote: | | And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. (Romans 8:9) |
| Quote: | | 38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2:38) |
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That's true.
And how do we receive "the gift" of the Spirit?
Gal. 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
4/16/16 7:59 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
Resident Skeptic |
| bradfreeman wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | bradfreeman wrote: | | Resident Skeptic wrote: | | The people in the wilderness were perishing for their rebellion against God. We too are perishing for our rebellion against God (verse 16). This is why Jesus used this analogy, to show Nicodemus that his identity as a good Pharisee and Jew would not justify him in the sight of God. In God's eyes he was no better than those of Moses' time that God's wrath through the serpents was being poured out on. The remedy would be a new birth/baptism of the Spirit of God that would be made available after Jesus was lifted up at Calvary. |
I agree.
Heb. 3:12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. 13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. 14 For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end, 15 while it is said,
“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts, as when they provoked Me.”
16 For who provoked Him when they had heard? Indeed, did not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? 17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who were disobedient? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief.
Heb. 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said,
“As I swore in My wrath,
They shall not enter My rest,”
although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.
It really isn't complicated.
Faith is the obedience that makes you righteous and gets you in.
Unbelief is the disobedience that leaves you unrighteous and keeps you out.
John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.”
What left them under wrath in the wilderness? The disobedience of unbelief.
What gets us into eternal life and rest? The obedience of faith. |
Yes, he who "has the Son" has eternal life. And how does one "have the Son"?....
| Quote: | | God has sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. (Gal. 4:6) |
| Quote: | | And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. (Romans 8:9) |
| Quote: | | 38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 2:38) |
|
That's true.
And how do we receive "the gift" of the Spirit?
Gal. 3:2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? |
We receive the gift of the Spirit through faith in the gospel. That faith includes obedience to the Son (yielding to his lordship)...
| Quote: | 30 The God of our ancestors raised Jesus from the dead—whom you killed by hanging him on a cross.
31 God exalted him to his own right hand as Prince and Savior that he might bring Israel to repentance and forgive their sins.
32 We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.” (Acts 5:30-32) |
The Jewish leaders Peter was addressing did not have faith unto salvation. They rejected the message that Christ was risen, exalted and given the sole authority to forgive sins. Thus they did not "obey the gospel" and could not receive the Spirit unto eternal life as the Apostles had done. They remained in their self righteousness and lost.
_________________
"It is doubtful if any Trinitarian Pentecostals have ever professed to believe in three gods, and Oneness Pentecostals should not claim that they do." - Daniel Segraves UPCI |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 8065
4/16/16 8:10 am
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| Re: Whether we like it or not ; |
bradfreeman |
| Resident Skeptic wrote: | | 32 We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.” (Acts 5:30-32) |
The Jewish leaders Peter was addressing did not have faith unto salvation. They rejected the message that Christ was risen, exalted and given the sole authority to forgive sins. Thus they did not "obey the gospel" and could not receive the Spirit unto eternal life as the Apostles had done. They remained in their self righteousness and lost.[/quote]
That's so true.
Obedience to our Lord means obeying his commands.
He commands faith and love...alone.
1 John 3:21 Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence before God; 22 and whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandments and do the things that are pleasing in His sight. 23 This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
_________________
I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
4/16/16 8:45 am
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| You boys are espousing |
brotherjames |
| some good Calvinist teaching there but he was wrong. Joseph Arminian had a bit of a different viewpoint and so did Paul according to Romans, Galatians. and Corinthians. I am saved by grace thru faith truly but my faith is expressed thru my works (lifestyle). If my works prove opposite to God's Word then whether I believe Jesus is the Son of God or not I am judged unrighteous in the sight of God. Even the demons believe and they tremble. |
Acts-celerater
Posts: 935
4/16/16 10:03 am
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| Re: You boys are espousing |
bradfreeman |
| brotherjames wrote: | | some good Calvinist teaching there but he was wrong. Joseph Arminian had a bit of a different viewpoint and so did Paul according to Romans, Galatians. and Corinthians. I am saved by grace thru faith truly but my faith is expressed thru my works (lifestyle). If my works prove opposite to God's Word then whether I believe Jesus is the Son of God or not I am judged unrighteous in the sight of God. Even the demons believe and they tremble. |
What does "if my works prove opposite to God's Word mean"?
If you think salvation by faith is a Calvinist viewpoint, you're wrong. Review your T-U-L-I-P.
Calvinism is the view that all the saved are pre-picked by God...the there is no freewill.
If you think you are judged righteous/unrighteous on your works, you're wrong and still living under an old covenant theology of self-righteousness.
John 3:18 He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
John 5:24 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.
1 John 4:17 By this, love is perfected with us, so that we may have confidence in the day of judgment; because as He is, so also are we in this world. 18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.
No, Jesus is our righteousness. We are righteous "apart from works".
Rom. 3:27 Where then is boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? Of works? No, but by a law of faith. 28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.
Rom. 4:4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness, 6 just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
7 “Blessed are those whose lawless deeds have been forgiven,
And whose sins have been covered.
8 “Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will not take into account.”
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I'm not saved because I'm good. I'm saved because He's good!
My website: www.bradfreeman.com
My blog: http://bradcfreeman.tumblr.com/ |
Acts-dicted
Posts: 9027
4/16/16 10:32 am
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Cojak |
I have said many times. Somethings are above my paygrade. This is.
I wish I knew how GOD reasoned, but I don't. I must use a Bible translated by men. Then discussed by EDUCATED, leaned guys who gave us many denominations.
I work on my own salvation. I don't even LIKE the conversational subject, bur I answer to God for me and what I say. So I will walk softly and not carry a big stick. 
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Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24277
4/16/16 10:40 pm
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