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 Cruz - citizen or not? |
c6thplayer1 |
Here's what reported;
Cruz - "Because my mother was a US citizen, born in Delaware, I was a US citizen by birth," he said in a 2013 statement."
"Obama's mother was born in Kansas "
Remember all the hurrah about Obama being born in Honolulu? The focus was the validity of his birth records. But if your mother is a US citizen then so are you regardless of where your born --- According to the republicans.
Just another example of a double standard the republicans stand on.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/heres-why-firestorm-over-ted-003631091.html |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
1/9/16 9:36 pm
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diakoneo |
I have never been a "birther" unlike Trump and a few other.
That being said, Cruz has already produced his birth certificate.
I find it odd that McCain wants to "look into it" when Hillary and Obama gave him a pass on his Panama Territory birth. Now there is your story. McCain wants Rubio.
I think Trump is truly the Republican establishment darling. The reality of who he is, is out there. Check it out. The man is no conservative. If he gets the nomination and becomes President, he will continue to bark loudly to the base and toe the company line. Mark my words! He will increase the deficit, get us in a couple more wars, usurp more power in the executive branch, do nothing about Obamacare. Yeah he might build a wall, but it will be to keep us in.
I HOPE HOPE HOPE I am wrong!!! But my gut tells me I am right! |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
1/9/16 10:02 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| diakoneo wrote: | I have never been a "birther" unlike Trump and a few other.
That being said, Cruz has already produced his birth certificate.
I find it odd that McCain wants to "look into it" when Hillary and Obama gave him a pass on his Panama Territory birth. Now there is your story. McCain wants Rubio.
I think Trump is truly the Republican establishment darling. The reality of who he is, is out there. Check it out. The man is no conservative. If he gets the nomination and becomes President, he will continue to bark loudly to the base and toe the company line. Mark my words! He will increase the deficit, get us in a couple more wars, usurp more power in the executive branch, do nothing about Obamacare. Yeah he might build a wall, but it will be to keep us in.
I HOPE HOPE HOPE I am wrong!!! But my gut tells me I am right! |
I guess the thing that erps me the most is the rant that Obama was not a US citizen even though his mother was born in Kansas but Cruz is a citizen because his mother was born in Delaware.
Really doesnt matter , I lost faith in the republican party a long time ago.
I ought to just write in Bullwinkle on the election ballot. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
1/9/16 10:10 pm
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Cojak |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: |
I guess the thing that erps me the most is the rant that Obama was not a US citizen even though his mother was born in Kansas but Cruz is a citizen because his mother was born in Delaware.
Really doesnt matter , I lost faith in the republican party a long time ago.
I ought to just write in Bullwinkle on the election ballot. |
I agree whole heartedly the GOP and double standards, then it is the same with both parties. They spin (that used to be TWIST) any situation to suit them.
BUT AS FOR TRUMP BEING A CONSERVATIVE, of course he is not. But this election is not about conservative/liberal. He took it away from there a long time ago. It is about someone saying what lots of Americans want to hear. Like 'someone' said on this forum, I do wish someone else was saying it!
I hear Jeb saying what he should have been saying months ago. Jeb should have went after the administration and Hillary long ago instead of the other candidates.
No TRump is not conservative, but I think he has smelled 'I CAN WIN' in the air and will be around. If he wins the nomination, he will probably get my vote. 
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http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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1/9/16 10:24 pm
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revuriah |
The whole Obama birther thing was an invention of Hillary Clinton in 2008. It was never a republican thing. Sure, a few conservative people may have jumped on the bandwagon, but no prominent conservative voices (Rush, Hannity, Cruz, etc.) were taking part from what I recall. Even if he was born in Kenya, his mom was a US citizen, and thus he is (though there is question over possible renunciation of citizenship).
I don't see a double standard here.
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Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3682
1/9/16 10:29 pm
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| Law of the blood, Law of the soil. |
Aaron Scott |
The issue is not if Cruz is a citizen. If his mother was a citizen, he is too.
The question is whether he is a natural born citizen, which is required of presidents. The argument could be that you are not natural born, since born in Canada. I don't think that will hold, but it's never really been tested.
Reminds me of some Shakespeare play where someone was "untimely" removed from his mothers womb by doctors, and so fulfilled the prophecy that no one born of a woman...you get the idea. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6042
1/10/16 8:00 am
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Nature Boy Florida |
Cruz is as much a natural born citizen as Obama - so there should not be a question about his eligibility. Obama solved that.
Diakoneo - Which candidate exactly will reduce the deficit? The Congress passes budgets - right now the Republicans just voted in a trillion dollar deficit for next year - so anyone in Congress that is a part of that group does not get my vote.
It doesn't leave many choices.
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Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16646
1/10/16 9:52 am
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| NBF...not quite |
Aaron Scott |
Yes, I believe they are both citizens and BORN citizens.
But if Cruz was born in Canada, the question that arises is the Constitutional demand that a president be a "natural born" citizen. Yes, we know that means not naturalized...but does it mean anything more? That has never been an issue in presidential politics (although it did keep Alexander Hamilton from running).
If Obama was born in Hawaii, he would be considered a natural born citizen. I think Cruz will pass this test, if challenged. It is just a fine point of law that some might want to argue (i.e., must be born ON U.S. soil). |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6042
1/10/16 9:59 am
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Cojak |
there are always Pregnant Citizens traveling outside the USA. Thousands of US service men stationed outside the USA with their spouse. Hundreds were born in GITMO. Still hundreds more in Germany on the local economy and not on a BASE. Embassy personnel's children are not born at the embassy (normally) and these should be considered as candidates for the presidency.
Funny that, I never thought of what c6th said about Obama, 'WE' many citizens (Including Trump) tried to disavow the present occupant of the White House and got carried away about a birth certificate. (phoney or not) evidently it did not matter if mama was a citizen.
I have two sons, one born in Mississippi the other in Missouri, some consider those 'foreign states'. 
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http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
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Posts: 24285
1/10/16 10:54 am
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diakoneo |
| Nature Boy Florida wrote: |
Diakoneo - Which candidate exactly will reduce the deficit? The Congress passes budgets - right now the Republicans just voted in a trillion dollar deficit for next year - so anyone in Congress that is a part of that group does not get my vote.
|
The congress passed a budget they knew Obama would sign to keep the government from shutting down. Cruz did not vote for it. I think Rubio was absent and did not vote. I agree it was a detestable thing to do (voting on that budget) How did your congressman vote on the issue? Mine, thankfully voted against it.
I say they should have proposed a good budget and sold it to the American people, then let Obama veto it. Put the ball in his court. I agree both Rs and Ds stink.
As to Trumps veto skills, who knows what he will do? He has no record as a public servant. He does have a record of schmoozing whoever he needs to, to get his way. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3382
1/10/16 11:21 am
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c6thplayer1 |
| revuriah wrote: | The whole Obama birther thing was an invention of Hillary Clinton in 2008. It was never a republican thing. Sure, a few conservative people may have jumped on the bandwagon, but no prominent conservative voices (Rush, Hannity, Cruz, etc.) were taking part from what I recall. Even if he was born in Kenya, his mom was a US citizen, and thus he is (though there is question over possible renunciation of citizenship).
I don't see a double standard here. |
Got to Challenge you on that Rev.
Hannity;
In 2011, Hannity repeatedly promoted Donald Trump’s utterly baseless attacks on President Obama’s birth certificate because, Trump suggested, it might show that Obama was not born in the U.S.
Now that Donald Trump has gone birther on Ted Cruz, Sean Hannity suddenly thinks there’s “no issue” if Cruz was born in another country.
http://crooksandliars.com/2016/01/sean-hannity-s-huuuge-birther-flip-flop
By early 2012, dozens of lawsuits had been filed challenging Obama's eligibility in states including North Carolina,[2] Ohio,[3] Pennsylvania,[4] Hawaii,[5] Connecticut,[6] New Jersey, Texas and Washington.[5][7] No suit or challenge has resulted in the grant of any relief to the plaintiffs by any court or other body.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_presidential_eligibility_litigation
Rush Limbaugh;
He continued, “Barack Obama has yet to have to prove that he’s a citizen. All he has to do is show a birth certificate. He has yet to have to prove he’s a citizen
[url]http://www.wnd.com/2009/07/104595/ [/url]
Limbaugh: 'Obama has yet to prove he's a citizen'
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2009/07/104595/#K7OloXVHsglm61lz.99
Cruz;
The post quotes the pictured Cruz, who was born in Calgary, Alberta, in December 1970 to an American mother and a Cuban-born father, saying Barack "Obama’s mother’s citizenship is irrelevant since his father wasn’t American and he wasn’t born in America. He can’t be president."
http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2015/mar/27/facebook-posts/facebook-meme-says-ted-cruz-flip-flopper-president/ |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
1/10/16 12:31 pm
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revuriah |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | | revuriah wrote: | The whole Obama birther thing was an invention of Hillary Clinton in 2008. It was never a republican thing. Sure, a few conservative people may have jumped on the bandwagon, but no prominent conservative voices (Rush, Hannity, Cruz, etc.) were taking part from what I recall. Even if he was born in Kenya, his mom was a US citizen, and thus he is (though there is question over possible renunciation of citizenship).
I don't see a double standard here. |
Got to Challenge you on that Rev.
Hannity;
In 2011, Hannity repeatedly promoted Donald Trump’s utterly baseless attacks on President Obama’s birth certificate because, Trump suggested, it might show that Obama was not born in the U.S.
Now that Donald Trump has gone birther on Ted Cruz, Sean Hannity suddenly thinks there’s “no issue” if Cruz was born in another country.
http://crooksandliars.com/2016/01/sean-hannity-s-huuuge-birther-flip-flop
By early 2012, dozens of lawsuits had been filed challenging Obama's eligibility in states including North Carolina,[2] Ohio,[3] Pennsylvania,[4] Hawaii,[5] Connecticut,[6] New Jersey, Texas and Washington.[5][7] No suit or challenge has resulted in the grant of any relief to the plaintiffs by any court or other body.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_presidential_eligibility_litigation
Rush Limbaugh;
He continued, “Barack Obama has yet to have to prove that he’s a citizen. All he has to do is show a birth certificate. He has yet to have to prove he’s a citizen
[url]http://www.wnd.com/2009/07/104595/ [/url]
Limbaugh: 'Obama has yet to prove he's a citizen'
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2009/07/104595/#K7OloXVHsglm61lz.99
Cruz;
The post quotes the pictured Cruz, who was born in Calgary, Alberta, in December 1970 to an American mother and a Cuban-born father, saying Barack "Obama’s mother’s citizenship is irrelevant since his father wasn’t American and he wasn’t born in America. He can’t be president."
http://www.politifact.com/texas/statements/2015/mar/27/facebook-posts/facebook-meme-says-ted-cruz-flip-flopper-president/ |
The article says that there is no evidence of Cruz making any such statement concerning Obama, and rates it as "Pants on Fire". So I don't believe Cruz said that. As for Hannity and Rush, what I do recall was that they called for Obama to simply show the certificate and put the controversy to bed once for all. I never heard either one claim he wasn't a citizen. I've been wrong before, and I reserve the right to be wrong.
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Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3682
1/10/16 2:29 pm
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revuriah |
From the Ted Cruz Politifact article linked:
| Quote: | No confirmation of either comment
Except, ahem, an extensive search of the Nexis news database and online news sources yields no sign of Cruz, a Houston lawyer elected to the Senate in 2012, making either statement. Our searches led us only to a March 26, 2015, web post on Debunkr.net saying the same; Cruz hasn’t made these comments. |
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The World As I See It
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Revuriah's Facebook
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www.myspace.com/547856946 |
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3682
1/10/16 2:31 pm
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UncleJD |
| diakoneo wrote: |
I find it odd that McCain wants to "look into it" when Hillary and Obama gave him a pass on his Panama Territory birth. Now there is your story. McCain wants Rubio. |
This
I was never a "birther" either because I understand the long established test of natural born citizen is not based on where you were born but whether your parent is a US citizen. The only thing about Obama is that there is a lot of evidence suggesting that he claimed to be a Kenyan citizen for college, it that were proven true then I feel it is the same as renouncing your US citizenship. |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
1/11/16 9:44 am
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c6thplayer1 |
| UncleJD wrote: | | diakoneo wrote: |
I find it odd that McCain wants to "look into it" when Hillary and Obama gave him a pass on his Panama Territory birth. Now there is your story. McCain wants Rubio. |
This
I was never a "birther" either because I understand the long established test of natural born citizen is not based on where you were born but whether your parent is a US citizen. The only thing about Obama is that there is a lot of evidence suggesting that he claimed to be a Kenyan citizen for college, it that were proven true then I feel it is the same as renouncing your US citizenship. |
We will never know for sure - his records are sealed. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
1/11/16 1:39 pm
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Eddie Robbins |
| Bottom line is that the Supreme Court has not ruled on it. It doesn't matter what anybody thinks, it matters how the law is interpreted. They need to rule on it now! |
Acts-pert Poster
Posts: 16509
1/11/16 1:55 pm
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Link |
I read an article that argued that at the time the constitution was written, there were two factors in consideration for being a natural born citizen-- what country your father was a citizen of and what country you were born in. Either of those would exclude Cruz.
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Link |
Acts-perienced Poster
Posts: 11849
1/11/16 2:36 pm
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UncleJD |
| Link wrote: | | I read an article that argued that at the time the constitution was written, there were two factors in consideration for being a natural born citizen-- what country your father was a citizen of and what country you were born in. Either of those would exclude Cruz. |
while the SCOTUS has never ruled on a Presidential election in terms of the "natural born citizen" clause (I've seen the cases, no time to look them up right now, maybe later), I believe they have referenced many cases over the years defining a natural-born-citizen to be anyone born to an American Citizen who has not renounced their citizenship. Think of it, if a soldier serving in a foreign land protecting this country has a child there, is that child not a natural-born-citizen? |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
1/11/16 3:34 pm
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c6thplayer1 |
| What if an american citizen has a child overseas. the child then is a US citizen. Now when that child grows up and has a child , his child to becomes a us citizen and so on and so on... if we stand by these measures. |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology
Posts: 6385
1/11/16 4:36 pm
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UncleJD |
| c6thplayer1 wrote: | | What if an american citizen has a child overseas. the child then is a US citizen. Now when that child grows up and has a child , his child to becomes a us citizen and so on and so on... if we stand by these measures. |
There's more to it than that, and I didn't want to spend the time, but here's a good link, you have to have lived in the US for a certain period of time and when you were a certain age to confer citizenship on the next generation "naturally".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_nationality_law |
Golf Cart Mafia Consigliere
Posts: 3147
1/11/16 4:54 pm
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