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Having an affair
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Post bonnie knox
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PS: Bonnie sometimes you have to reason through scripture. They could have brought David a lot of different things to try to warm him up but they brought him a women hmmmmm


If your point is that Abishag is evidence that David was a womanizer, I would have to disagree.
She did not have sex with David.

Your admonition for me to reason through scripture is a little scary, given that you characterize David as womanizer, say we make a bigger deal of adultery than God does, and that you think Adonijah was willing to trade the kingdom for Abishag.
Maybe you're getting Adonijah and Abishag mixed up with the Prince of Wales and Wallis Simpson.
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4/11/11 3:26 pm


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Post Lee Roy Brown
bonnie knox wrote:
Quote:
PS: Bonnie sometimes you have to reason through scripture. They could have brought David a lot of different things to try to warm him up but they brought him a women hmmmmm


If your point is that Abishag is evidence that David was a womanizer, I would have to disagree.
She did not have sex with David.

Your admonition for me to reason through scripture is a little scary, given that you characterize David as womanizer, say we make a bigger deal of adultery than God does, and that you think Adonijah was willing to trade the kingdom for Abishag.
Maybe you're getting Adonijah and Abishag mixed up with the Prince of Wales and Wallis Simpson.


I didn't say that. I said we hold unto it longer then God does. Davidís sin cost him a lot. Sin does cost us. God also uses people after they have sinned, sometimes he even uses people when they are sinning. Adultery is a big deal in society just ask 60 percent of married men and 40 percent of married women who statistics say has cheated on their spouse in America. I'm so glad God hasnít wrote these people off yet.

So letís talk about scripture. At the end of the kings life the only thing they could think of that would warm him was a women? Adonijah was willing to surrender the kingdom for a women. It might not have been his idea but he did settle on it. Put all of those aside tell me what to do with Solomon?
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4/11/11 4:55 pm


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Post Nature Boy Florida
Sorry Lee Roy.

You are incorrect.

I'm afraid God holds onto it longer IF they don't repent.

Everlasting separation or something like that sounds like a long time to me.

He is also the only one that knows if they have truly repented or not. The rest of us need to see fruits of repentance before we will believe.

Sorry you are so judgmental of everyone else that you don't think are as "with it" and "in the know" as you are concerning adultery.

Perhaps you should repent of that.
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4/11/11 5:23 pm


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Post bonnie knox
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So letís talk about scripture. At the end of the kings life the only thing they could think of that would warm him was a women? Adonijah was willing to surrender the kingdom for a women. It might not have been his idea but he did settle on it. Put all of those aside tell me what to do with Solomon?


No, they tried to warm him with clothes, first. I think a human body was a good idea seeing as how they didn't have electric blankets.
You're way off base on Adonijah. He did not willingly surrender the kingdom. You should go back and read I Kings 1 and 2.

Solomon's wives turned his heart away from God.
I Kings 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father.
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4/11/11 6:28 pm


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Post Is there really such thing as an innocent party in an caseyleejones
adulterous situation? Not intending to justify adultery, but, it would seem that adultery was the trump card in an already doomed marriage. While I do not know of every adultery situation out there, every one that I know of(which is quite numerous), the other party was not so innocent. Acts-perienced Poster
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4/11/11 6:41 pm


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Post Re: a quote from Tom Sterbens Carolyn Smith
bonnie knox wrote:
usefull, your original question was, if I understand it, how can pastors and ABs have affairs - what are they thinking?
About a month ago, Tom Sterbens posted this, which I dug back out because I think it will help answer your question.

Entitlement and the Absence of Time Spent With God and the Word

I have either talked with extensively or counseled probably 30 guys who have done this (albeit not just with their assistant). In my personal experience these two things are recurrent...

Common to all of them is a sense of self entitlement regarding "happiness." They deserved to be happy. God would want them happy. And so they pursue "happy" on their own terms. In the end it is just pride.

As a result, they becomes convinced that their problem is unique. Seriously. Please don't just read right by that one. They really think that their problem is so complex, distinct, exclusive, that the remedy available to the majority (even biblical and spiritual remedy) will not work for them. indeed this is just another manifestation of the pride/entitlement issue, but the deception of this aspect creates an almost hypnotic state.

Second, I have been amazed...really amazed at the recurring confession/acknowledgment of absence of time spent with God and the Word. And for many, if not the majority, the Word became hardly more than a tool of the trade.

As overly simplistic as the next statement will sound, here it is: They fell out of love with God. In almost every instance the primary difficulty and objective was to get them to passionately embrace God's Word as the final declaration concerning "wholeness" of life and subsequent function or behavior (substitution terminology for holiness and righteousness).

What I've offered is certainly subjective, in terms of being my personal experience with these situations.

~~~ Tom Sterbens ~~~


Excellent, just excellent.
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4/11/11 9:22 pm


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Post Carolyn Smith
Lee Roy Brown wrote:
Iím always amazed with this subject comes up and the condemnation that many bring. We sometimes speak of King Davidís sin and forget that it goes so much deeper than that. If there was ever a case for a generational curse Davidís family would be it. David has a problem with women and this issue doesnít even escape him at death. When he is dying only the warm body of a virgin girl can make him feel better. Davidís eldest son Adonijah declares himself king and gathers his army to take his reign. Once he realizes that Solomon is going to take over as king his only request not to fight for the throne was a woman. So sick that even his mother tries to broker the deal for her son to get this woman he desires. Think about it Adonijah is willing to give up his kingship just for the lust of a woman.


From what I understand about Abishag, the reason Adonijah wanted to marry her had nothing to do with lust - unless it was lust for the kingdom. To paraphrase a note in my Bible (and teaching I've heard), even though Abishag was a virgin, she was still considered a part of David's harem, which was considered his royal property and was to be passed on to his successor. Adonijah had not given up hope that he would be king, and this was a sly move on his behalf to try to take the kingdom. Having one of David's "women" would have strengthened his position to take the throne.

I'd never understood why Solomon was so angry with Bathsheba re: this until I heard some teaching in this vein. Makes sense.
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4/11/11 9:32 pm


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Post Tom's quote Cojak
I really appreciate that being repeated for this post. I cut one line out that I think is very good wisdom and insight, this one, quote Tom Sterbens:
Second, I have been amazed...really amazed at the recurring confession/acknowledgment of absence of time spent with God and the Word. And for many, if not the majority, the Word became hardly more than a tool of the trade.

There is so much truth there for ALL of us and especially for ALL MINISTERS. I think this applies over the board, not just about affairs.

I really like it when I can read something that just jumps off the page at me.
Thanks loads Bonnie, for reposting it, I guess it didn't jump out the first time. A lot like reading scripture.
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Last edited by Cojak on 4/11/11 9:38 pm; edited 2 times in total
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4/11/11 9:36 pm


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Post Carolyn Smith
Stay Strong wrote:
Many people do this due to abuse of power. Take professional athletes for example. When they arrive at their hotel they can have the pick of women as each one has several wanting to be with them for the night. That's abuse of power. For the athlete who wants to stay faithful to their wife, this is a tough temptation, but one has to walk above it.


This is one of those things that has to be decided a long time before you get to that moment. Just as teenagers in the backseat of a car have to decide before they ever get there - how much do they value their virginity or their commitment to stay pure? Your mind has to be made up before you ever get to that point - with athletes or preachers or whomever. Because if you wait until that moment to make such a decision, your flesh is going to win, and you are going to lose big time.
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4/11/11 9:37 pm


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Post Stay strong wrote Cojak
Take professional athletes for example. When they arrive at their hotel they can have the pick of women as each one has several wanting to be with them for the night. That's abuse of power. For the athlete who wants to stay faithful to their wife, this is a tough temptation, but one has to walk above it.

A very close friend went pro in Baseball. He was always a dedicated Christian and a great ball player. He was Pro for a couple years in great demand, but suddenly quit.

I saw him a few months later and asked WHY?
He said it is near impossible to have a family life, and temptations are unbelieveable. I knew he never gave in, he was that strong. He was also that wise. Harold lives in Cleveland now. We had dinner with him and his wife on our last round the USA trip. His wife needs prayer. Please remember her, and Remember a strong man, Harold.

And thanks Stay strong for putting that line in your comment.
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4/11/11 9:50 pm


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Post Carolyn Smith
Lee Roy Brown wrote:

All you deep theologians wouldnít go over good in my church. So let me say it in a way that would work for my people. God uses and blesses messed up people, God uses and blesses messed up people that we write off. God wants these people to change but some of these messed up people take years to change. God still uses these messed up people. I know Iím one of them.


Forgive me for taking so much space tonight, but this commentary today gave me a lot I wanted to say.

Yes, God uses messed up people. God is much more longsuffering with people than the church tends to be. We are very black & white when it comes to certain sins (other things like gossip and gluttony, not so much...) God CAN use messed up people, and He frequently does. But I don't see how you can say He blesses them, because they keep falling back into the sin and repeating the cycle of failure BY THEIR CHOICE. We don't have a promise of tomorrow and to think that God uses and blesses messed up people comes awfully close to the sin of presumption: presuming that because God has been merciful to me today, He will keep on being merciful to me tomorrow and He is blessing me even though I am knowingly, willfully sinning.

God can use whomever He wants, whenever He want, and He does use messed up people that we don't think He could/should. But don't get too excited, He used a donkey to speak, too. But sometimes if/when that happens, we take that as a stamp of God's approval on a person/situation, when in fact, it is just His mercy and love in operation.

I've been listening to a Rick Godwin sermon recently, and he talked about how that God used Samson, but he had no character. He fell into sin in one verse. Yes, he was talented, and he was anointed, but we shouldn't be exalting in the church someone simply because they are talented or anointed, unless they have character and integrity to go with it! We need someone like Joseph that runs from sin and remains strong in his integrity throughout the scripture.
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4/11/11 9:56 pm


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Post For Bonnie Carolyn Smith
Bonnie - answered your question about the one night stand here...

http://www.actscelerate.com/viewtopic.php?t=62501
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Post Carolyn, bonnie knox
Lots of good points tonight.

(And from what I'm told, there is no limit to space on this forum. Very Happy )
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4/11/11 10:41 pm


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Post Re: Carolyn, Carolyn Smith
bonnie knox wrote:
Lots of good points tonight.

(And from what I'm told, there is no limit to space on this forum. Very Happy )


Yeah...just seems like I used more than my quota tonight. LOL
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4/11/11 10:43 pm


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Post Stay Strong
Carolyn Smith wrote:
Stay Strong wrote:
Many people do this due to abuse of power. Take professional athletes for example. When they arrive at their hotel they can have the pick of women as each one has several wanting to be with them for the night. That's abuse of power. For the athlete who wants to stay faithful to their wife, this is a tough temptation, but one has to walk above it.


This is one of those things that has to be decided a long time before you get to that moment. Just as teenagers in the backseat of a car have to decide before they ever get there - how much do they value their virginity or their commitment to stay pure? Your mind has to be made up before you ever get to that point - with athletes or preachers or whomever. Because if you wait until that moment to make such a decision, your flesh is going to win, and you are going to lose big time.


Excellent point Carolyn. One has to make a pre meditated decision to walk above the temptation of sin. These athletes know full well that there will be women waiting on them. Best thing to do, when they are waiting, is to ignore them or offer an autograph or two, get into the hotel room and call the wife and tell her how much you miss her.
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4/12/11 7:39 am


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Post Re: Stay strong wrote Stay Strong
Cojak wrote:

A very close friend went pro in Baseball. He was always a dedicated Christian and a great ball player. He was Pro for a couple years in great demand, but suddenly quit.

I saw him a few months later and asked WHY?
He said it is near impossible to have a family life, and temptations are unbelieveable. I knew he never gave in, he was that strong. He was also that wise. Harold lives in Cleveland now. We had dinner with him and his wife on our last round the USA trip. His wife needs prayer. Please remember her, and Remember a strong man, Harold.

And thanks Stay strong for putting that line in your comment.


No problem brother. I will keep them in prayer and it's great to hear when one of them walks away from money for the sake of their family. Too many times in our culture we emphasize the success of a man by the bottom line on his paycheck. Being a family guy has taken a backseat in this culture which is very sad. All that money and material items, we can't take them with us. We leave the earth the same way we showed up, penniless. All that really matters then is what did you do with the time allotted to you on Earth and did you try to bring up your kids to love the Lord.
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4/12/11 7:45 am


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Post Nature Boy Florida
Satan uses messed up people, as well.

It works even better when the folks say they are Christians but their heart (and their actions) are far from God.

A bunch of messed up "christians" are going to be mighty surprised - even though they led worship, prophesied, and did lots of church stuff in Jesus' name - yet Jesus will say "Depart from me, I NEVER knew you."
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4/12/11 7:53 am


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Post youngbishop81
Nature Boy Florida wrote:
Satan uses messed up people, as well.

It works even better when the folks say they are Christians but their heart (and their actions) are far from God.

A bunch of messed up "christians" are going to be mighty surprised - even though they led worship, prophesied, and did lots of church stuff in Jesus' name - yet Jesus will say "Depart from me, I NEVER knew you."


I think that message was talking more about the religious folks, the Pharisees who think they have need of nothing. Most messed up people I pastor know they are messed up and work very hard to live for God, these people donít even assume anything about their walk with God accept that they love him and they need him every day. Itís the religious judgmental people who think they will walk right into heaven that might get a surprise.
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4/12/11 10:15 am


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Post bonnie knox
Lee Roy Brown wrote:
God seems to want to keep the focus on Jesus and not the private lives of his ministers rather for the good or for the bad.


It occurred to me that I know of one other poster who uses rather when he means whether, the only other one who also uses the condescending "Miss Bonnie" when referring to me. Hmmm.
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4/12/11 11:07 am


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Post bonnie knox
By the way, Lee Roy, Bathsheba was not Adonijah's mother. Have you read I Kings chapters 1 and 2 lately? [Insert Acts Pun Here]
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4/12/11 12:27 pm


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