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We speak what will be...
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Post We speak what will be... Yo Dude
I was reading an article about a private banker that, at his wealthy client's instruction, purchased the client a "hoard of gold" and had it physically stored in Switzerland...as a hedge against a dirty bomb in America.

I was thinking that most of us do not have the connections or wherewithal to buy properties in distant, "safe" areas, to stockpile gold and other non-derivative sorts of wealth, and so on. Quite simply, the ultra wealthy have all sorts of "shelters"--financial, personal, physical, and so on.

But we have the Word of the Lord. And I'm not speaking just of the written word of God.

I am saying that, if we have the faith, we can SPEAK safety to ourselves and our families, we can COMMAND provision in time of need, we can CALL FORTH healing in time of sickness.

How? We are the CHILDREN of the most high God. We are not distant servants, or those who are afar off. We are His CHILDREN. And if you're earthly father would provide for you in time of need, even with limited resources, HOW MUCH MORE will your Heavenly Father do that for HIS CHILDREN?

And so, yes, we realize that there is danger all about us. We can hope and wish that all will be well...or we can SPEAK IN FAITH what WILL BE...and it WILL BE!

It's not some gum machine where you just SAY something. No, it is saying it in FAITH...which means that when you say it, you will KNOW (and not just hope, wish, and pray) that it MUST HAPPEN.

Not because you are so special in yourself. But because you are special to your Father, and HE backs you up! HE stands good for your expenses, so to speak. And why shouldn't He? After all, He owns the Universe--and if we ever spend it all up, He can make another Universe just to stay in the black!

Do you get it? Do you GET IT?

We don't have to be billionaires to provide for all these things that are against us. We are the CHILDREN of GOD. The ONE Who governs it all, the One Who allows or disallows what happens. We have it so much better than even the wealthiest, most powerful, most connected of people, for we have JESUS, the great Son of God, Bishop of Souls, King of Kings and Lord of Lords!

Who is there--anywhere, anytime--that has even registered when it comes to comparing to this Jesus? And yet He calls us Friends...and yet we are joint-heirs WITH HIM...and yet His Father calls us HIS CHILDREN.

We have it made! WE HAVE IT MADE!
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4/10/06 5:39 pm


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Post Dude Kenny L Flaming
Have you been listening to Copeland and Crefflo again?
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4/10/06 5:45 pm


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Post amen and amen Dude! ProsperousBigMouth
That kind explains my screen name. And it is true baby!!!

It puts me in mind of the teacher that told us not to say "MY 'ailment inserted here'" theres power in them there words!!!
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4/10/06 5:47 pm


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Post The continued corruption of Pentecost Pastor Gary
This is exactly the kind of ant-Biblical doctrinal nonsense that is corrupting the pentecostal movement at the core, The Azusa Steet commemoration is featuring the likes of Hinn, Dollar and others. It sickens me.

The Bible teaches clearly that GOD speaks reality into existence, but it is the height of presumption to extrapolate from that US speaking reality into existence.

News flash: two instant clues that you are drifting into cultic territory---

(1) Any teaching that demotes God to the level of man;
(2) Any teaching that elevates man to the level of God.
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4/10/06 6:12 pm


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Post Hmmm.. What say you now YO.... c6thplayer1
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4/10/06 6:23 pm


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Post Folks, I Don't Know What to Say... Yo Dude
I don't listen to Creflo or Copeland--I MAY have heard a grand total of 2 Creflo services (if that) and 5 Copeland (if that). I don't follow after Hinn--in fact, outside of watching the worship part of his services, I have little interest.

I have NOWHERE elevated myself to God's level. And I have certainly not demoted Him to mine! How dare you say that as a means of argumentation. That is both fallacious...and, to be honest, it's playing dirty.

Folks, I fully understand that it is NOT MY WORDS that make it so...it is my FAITH in the FATHER, and my Father's love and backing of me, that makes it so.

I made that clear. But that was ignored. No wonder we see so few miracles today. We don't WANT that level of power, because then, if we fail, we don't get to blame it on "God's will." We have to accept that it is us being of little faith that is the problem--HEAVEN FORBID!

Lie about it, castigate them, call them heretics, cultists--ANYTHING!--just don't allow it to be possible that WE, someway, somehow, with the best of intentions, fail to touch the Lord in faith.

Do you not think that our Father wants us to mature and DO THE WORK? Are you content to always sit in the highchair and never grow to walk in the authority of your Father? Are you just wanting to float passively through, when all the time, if we would but speak it in faith, it would be ours?

Did you notice that Jesus got on to the disciples on the stormy sea? "Oh ye of little faith." Why was He doing that?

BECAUSE THEY COULD HAVE REBUKED THE WIND THEMSELVES!

It's all from God. None of it is us. We are simply speaking in FAITH, knowing that when we do, our Father backs us up.

We can't speak under the anointing and NOT be in His will. We can't speak in Faith and speak contrary to His will.

I'm not claiming any great faith. I am claiming, however, that this situation does exist! I have not attained it yet, but I want to. And I know that one sure way to miss out is to blindly stand down because you have spoken falsely against this (even if with no ill-intentions).

Let those who GET IT, GET IT. And those who don't, let them keep blaming God.

Like they always have.
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4/10/06 6:41 pm


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Post OK YO....... sheepdogandy
Do it.

Quit talking about it and do it.

Declare your name and whereabouts on this board and do it.

Keep the board posted of your successes.

Enable us to validate your claims.

As you have stated you have nothing to fear.

Back it up.

Show me (and Gary) that our interpretation of Scripture in in error.

I can stand to be corrected. I have been before.
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4/10/06 7:22 pm


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Post Re: OK YO....... Pastor Gary
sheepdogandy wrote:
Do it.
...Show me (and Gary) that our interpretation of Scripture in in error.

I can stand to be corrected. I have been before.


Precisely. If anyone here who claims they can speak things into existence is willing to put that belief to the test the way Elijah put his to the test, I'll pay your plane fare to Hawaii to speak a new facility into existence for my church. If you fail, you pay your own way and admit you have been wrong.

I have a location picked out. Bring on the faith speaking!
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4/10/06 7:33 pm


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Post Re: We speak what will be... Kenny L Flaming
Dude

You may claim that you do not follow (listen) to the WOF'ers crowd but you uses the same vernacular as I have each one of the 'Name it Claim it" use.

I for one am tired of hearing all the "claims" of these folk but not seeing the fruit- The only ones making the claims and making the $ are the ones on TBN touting their latest book or "passover offering scheme" to the gullible Christian public.

The whole teaching that is present is a mis-representation of the true gospel- among the many fallacies that is presented is the Jesus Died Spiritually" teaching, this too denegrates the truth of the gospel to a man devised, man made philosphy that has no basis in scriture.

Dude, this is not an attack on you, I have no right as a christian to do that. This is a pastor that has spent many years ministering to the peopel left in the aftermath of this false teaching. Am I passionate about this yes I am. I had to re-write this post a number of times to tone it down so it would not come across as "caustic". Fervent and passionate YES - Caustic -NO!
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4/10/06 7:37 pm


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Post Re: We speak what will be... Travis Johnson
What did Yo Dude say that was so bad?

What we speak determines a lot of how we live and exist. If we sow fear, we will reap fear. If we sow sloth, we will reap lack. If we sow negativity, we will reap failure. If we sow an I can do all things through Christ attitude, we will reap the positive impact of a God that agrees with His own words.

Without reading into what Yo Dude said, I think I can pretty much agree with that. Now, if we've been burnt by hyper prosperity teaching, I can see how it would be easy to read into what he said and come up with a conclusion beyond his words. And, maybe he meant something beyond what he wrote. But, I don't see anything at all wrong with what he wrote.
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4/10/06 8:34 pm


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Post Dude .. heresy .. repent of it Rafael D Martinez
You may not read Creflo or Copeland. But you arrived at the same conclusions -- that your words physically manifest God's blessing, and that YOU have the same prerogative to be like He was at Creation.

Man, can't you see just how really lost in space that is?

This is where your continuing revelation doctrine is taking you.

You stated you felt we could voice "Scripture" today that is as valid as the Bible itself. That's a direct rejection of the sufficiency of the Word

You felt that the Trinity was unbiblical in clear view of the Scriptures teaching otherwise. That's a direct rejection of the very nature of God.

It doesn't get much worse than this.

You get these foundations of faith wrong, my brother, and you are heading into some very serious error. Your drift into unbiblical teaching is becoming both serious and tragic. I pray you truly and speedily reconsider. And no, this isn't an attempt to attack you .. but a sincere request that you really prayerfully think about what's being said here to you not just by me, but by others ..

agape

rafael
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4/10/06 8:43 pm


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Post Dude SCFIRE
Don't let anyone take the wind out of your sails. We are not where we have been, and surely not where we are gonna be. The process is continuing.
The One that has started a good work in us will surely complete it.
Speak the Word over YOUR good ground and watch the harvest continue to come up.
I will not stand in the gate and be run over by those who are possessing the Kingdom of God.
Go, Dude................
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4/10/06 8:44 pm


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Post Anybody notice?????? sheepdogandy
The posters who are graciously attempting to help Yo.

Have revealed who they are on Acts.

Does it make a difference?

Yeah, I think maybe it does.

Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor
Summervile Pentecostal Worship Center
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4/10/06 8:49 pm


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Post Re: Dude Hishanmaden
wardlinepastor wrote:
Have you been listening to Copeland and Crefflo again?


My thoughts exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!
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4/10/06 9:22 pm


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Post Re: We speak what will be... SCFIRE
No, I'm not oneness, and I do believe in a pre-trib rapture, but what Dude said in the above post is a powerful and well worth listening to.
The difference it will make with me is that Harvest is increasing, more souls are being saved, and more filled with the Holy Ghost in our meetings than ever before. Healings are coming more often and more pronounced. Churches are being healed of long standing rifts and being set on fire. Tongues and interpretation and prophecy are to be the norm in the church services and tongues are to be heard in the worship services with a constant increase of God's glory. Anything less than that is watered down and not what was intended.
There is no shame in this game.
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4/10/06 9:32 pm


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Post Really? Pastor Gary
SCFIRE wrote:
Tongues and interpretation and prophecy are to be the norm in the church services and tongues are to be heard in the worship services with a constant increase of God's glory. Anything less than that is watered down and not what was intended.


Would you be so kind as to quote the scriptural basis for that statement?
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4/10/06 9:37 pm


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Post Re: We speak what will be... SCFIRE
I Cor 14:26 I went to 8 different translations and all share the same thought that when we gather we are to have: Singing, teaching, revelation, doctrine, tongues & interpretation which when prophecy is given equals to tongues & interpretation. All of this for the strenghtening of the church. If a message is given out in tongues, it is to be interpreted. If praise & worship is given in tongues it is to be enjoyed by the Father and equally enjoyed by the church because the Father is receiving it.
This is the norm.
Actually tongues are a sign to those who don't believe and will be an excellent sign when the proper instructions are followed. When the interpretations are given their hearts will be touched.
John Wesley prayed this prayer. Lord send us the old revival without all the defects, but if this can not be, then send it with all the defects, but we must have revival.
Education plus manifestation equals revival. Spirit & Truth equals revival.
I've enjoyed success too long with this method to stop now.
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4/10/06 10:11 pm


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Post Re: We speak what will be... Pastor Gary
SCFIRE wrote:
I Cor 14:26 I went to 8 different translations and all share the same thought that when we gather we are to have: Singing, teaching, revelation, doctrine, tongues & interpretation which when prophecy is given equals to tongues & interpretation. All of this for the strenghtening of the church. If a message is given out in tongues, it is to be interpreted. If praise & worship is given in tongues it is to be enjoyed by the Father and equally enjoyed by the church because the Father is receiving it.
This is the norm.


And verse 40 says "But everything should be done in a fitting and orderly way." I am sure that is what you are describing, isn't it? Not the chaotic, unruly mess I have seen in the past.
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Post Re: We speak what will be... SCFIRE
That's why I stated, "when proper instructions are followed"
Yes, I have been highly turned off by undisciplined church services that produced nothing but noise & distraction. Believe it or not, I do know what you are trying to prevent from happening in a church service. Training and teaching the body is the only way to make everything work properly.
There does need to be a balance.
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Post Rafael...You have a conflict of interest Yo Dude
You are unwilling to abide by the scripture because to do so would mean rejecting the "doctrine" that you have built your reputation on.

Look, it is NOT contrary to scripture to interpret the scriptures to be saying something besided a trinitarian viewpoint! Not at all. My conclusion is PERFECTLY LEGITIMATE. Now, I could be wrong, yes. My conclusion may be the wrong one...but IT IS a fair one. So how dare you call me a heretic for working out my own salvation--or did you conveniently forget that scripture?

As for there being new scripture, there most certainly is! Is it accepted by the church-at-large? No. But it is of the same quality and power as that written in the KJV.

Now, I'm not arguing that everything that is said is scripture--no more than everything that was said back then was scripture. I AM arguing, however, that there ARE revelations that are of the same power and quality and caliber as what Paul said, what Mark said, what Peter said.

And you know what, Rafael, you take me to task for this belief, NOT because there is a SINGLE scripture on your side, but because...well, because at some point or another, their was a MAN MADE decision to close the canon...as if God has stopped speaking to His church.

I ABSOLUTELY believe in the sufficiency of the existing scriptures. We need no more to have eternal life. But I also believe a person can make it to heaven without the baptism of the Holy Ghost. That is, we don't have to have continuing scripture...but it is a blessing to us to have it.

For that matter, if we tore out the books of Matthew and Mark...we could still make it, don't you think? And, conversely, if we ADD another collection of anointed words, we will still make it, so long as they are indeed of the Lord.

And as for those who have challenge me to "speak" something into existence, I have made no personal claim of such power--although I have spoken things and they came to pass. All I am saying is that IT IS POSSIBLE, according to the Scripture and the Spirit, to SAY to this mountain, "be thou removed," and it will be so!

Elijah said "no rain," and there was no rain.

Peter said, "Rise up and walk," and the man did.

It wasn't their words. It wasn't them. It was their FAITH in the LORD that caused Him to back up their words. It was their connection to Him that made it all happen.

Yes, there is a place for ASKING. And there is a place for SAYING.

If I am treading where the WOF-ers tread, then I came by it honestly, and by God's illumination to my heart. And even if there are charltans, and even if there have been disappointments, GOD'S WORD IS STILL TRUE! He has empowered us to serve as His ambassadors, and as such we have been given power.

Now, do we only have power to PASSIVELY WAIT for God to do things? Do we have this power so that we can PLEAD AND BEG God for this or that? Do we have this power so that we can "handle" it when things don't happen?

No! We have this POWER to DO THE WORK OF THE MINISTRY! Not to sit around with it all bottled up, to be used only if we the heaven's open and we are commanded in a thunderous voice to do something.

WE are to be led of the SPIRIT. And if you are, you will JUST DO what God is wanting done. When you feel divine compassion, you will KNOW that it is time to speak...not time to pray about whether you should speak...not time to pray about what God's will is...for His will is manifest to you by the Spirit at the moment you feel divine compassion.

And when you feel NOT to pray, then don't. Don't seek a sign to show you that you should NOT pray. FOLLOW THE SPIRIT.

When the Spirit rises up in you to command the universe to be ordered to the Will of God, the SAY IT--and it will be done!

Do you feel divine unction for a new building in Hawaii? THEN SPEAK IT IN FAITH and see if it is not so!

Don't just speak because you would like a new building (although I believe that some people have that level of faith). Speak it because you KNOW God will back up your words. YOU are the one with the VISION for it. YOU are the one with the burden and compassion for it. So if you feel the Spirit rising in you do do it, the YOU DO IT!

Joshua didn't pray about stopping the sun and moon. He just SAID IT. And it was so. He knew God was on their side, he knew he was right with God, and he knew they had to have more time.

Yes, Joshua could have thought, "Well, God can do this tomorrow, or help us get done real quick before the sun goes down...or perhaps over the next few years well just wipe them all out a little at a time."

But no. He felt he needed more daylight--and he said it, and it was.

I don't have that sort of faith, but there it is, for all to see.
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