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Sweethomealabama

Is it Florida Cocoa or is it Florida Leesburg office? redistricting in COG state offices.

Sweethomealabama · Hey, DOC Posts: 66 **4/8/24 10:08 am**

It appears that talks about Church of God redistricting of state offices have been in the works for a while. We have seen it with talks of Tennessee splitting into 2 districts and in recent memory Ohio State office reunifying. I've noticed over the last few assemblies that a lot of state offices are combining Hispanic ministries into Super regional offices that span multiple states The AG has pioneered that model, but it begs to question is Cocoa office and black ministries about to undergo a similar transition? It seems to me that the church of God may want to restructure some of its ministries into a more cost-effective manner. For example, if black ministries in the COG started to go the route of the Hispanic ministries with Super regional offices and have state black district pastors. I see a great benefit to that. But on the flipside, I can also see where it's almost becomes a self imposed segregation. I love my Hispanic brothers and my heart goes out to a state overseer having to navigate the waters of the language barrier in handling a Hispanic church issue, but black ministries does not have a language barrier. The issue with black ministries in the CoG is more of about culture and heart issue than anything else. I personally don’t want to segregate, but let’s face it until a black man or a Hispanic man can become general overseer or a state overseer of a place like Texas, Alabama or Tennessee the COG culture has barriers for them. I don’t believe these barriers are intentional. I think they just happen to fall that way. How do we turn it around? That’s why I believe William Lee would be a great effective general overseer eventually. I personally Would love to see it within the next 8yrs.

Florida recently has recently become home to southeastern Hispanic Church of God offices. The Hispanic offices are nearby Florida State executive offices in Tampa do we see the Cocoa office restructuring as a move of the office to be closer to the other two offices? Could Cocoa take the Hispanic ministries model and consolidate the southeastern state offices, black ministries into one super regional office out of the present Cocoa office?

Aaron Scott

About Florida....

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 6032 **4/9/24 12:16 pm**

Florida should move its State Office to the campground in Wimauma. While it will be farther for those who live/come from Tampa, it will be closer to many other Churches of God. Also, assuming we pay a lease on our current facilities, that could save us a tremendous amount of money.

As for combining Cocoa with Tampa, I think that an inquiry with our black brethren would find that they were very hesitant to do that. First, it likely serves us far better to have our black leaders lead Cocoa, since if we combined, our white constituency would so outnumber our black members that it would, name recognition being what it is, effectively ensure that our black leaders no longer had a role in leadership in the Church of God.

That is, white bishops, relying very much on name recognition, would likely not cast many votes for black bishops since the names would not be so well known to them.

Further, the way we have this structured has developed a solid corps of good leaders in Cocoa. It would be a travesty to take this away from them...UNLESS THEY WANTED IT SUCH. And I feel confident that they don't want to simply become invisible, a grain of pepper, so to speak, in a bottle of salt. They have a unique culture that should be preserved and cherished, and the best way to do that, I think, is to continue forward, as is.

At the same time, I think there ought to be some seats at the top set aside for our black leaders. They simply do not stand much of a chance of getting the recognition they deserve without something like this, since relatively few would know names and who to vote for.

Sweethomealabama

Hey, DOC Posts: 66 **4/19/24 12:40 pm**

Great response Aaron . I appreciate the time you took to write me.

Is it Florida Cocoa or is it Florida Leesburg?

I don't know if the Tampa executive offices are paid off, but the land is in the state's name according to public records. It was said that if the offices were sold in Florida, they would rent office space from a local church and liquidate the Wimauma campground, transitioning to a regional camp meeting system with the panhandle (Jacksonville, Tampa, Orlando, and Miami). It is said that if the state overseer made a goal to speak at every Church of God in the Tampa offices' jurisdiction, it would take over four years speaking every Wednesday and Sunday. That would be three times a week, going to a different church on Sunday morning, Sunday evening, and Wednesday evening.

I suspect that they are now transitioning the restructuring plan to the Cocoa state offices. With the state office and state parsonage sold, now might be the time for them to "cross the BRIDGE," so to speak. Cragmont Road seems to be becoming the center of attention with the Southeast Hispanic Super Regional Office, encompassing the Hispanic ministries of multiple states. This may be the bargaining chip headquarters is using to negotiate a pivot with the Cocoa office.

Think about it; this means you would be over black ministries, indirectly for the entire Southeast, similar to the Southeast Hispanic office. And them relocating everything to Tampa makes sense. So the question is, are they going to rent a church to build the bridge? Are they going to move to the state campground? I think for the sake of money that would make the most sense because the land is paid for. But let's say you need to move things around, I guess politically it would make sense to rent a local church, who knows from a money-moving standpoint. The campground makes the most sense.

I just hate that our black brothers and sisters are in a situation of white guardianship to the point that they must feel uncomfortable about the situation. There are two stories of white guardianship. One was called the story of the world's richest black girl. This girl's family was raised in extreme poverty, but they somehow owned land in Oklahoma on some of the most oil-rich properties in the state. Because she was black, the state government required that she had to have a white man to oversee her inheritance because both of her parents were dead, and she was orphaned. The NAACP had to come to her defense, and it was one of their biggest cases because it was discovered that the man managing her finances, robbing her and purposefully mis-managing her money to sell it others.

There's another case of white guardianship that affected the Native American tribes in Oklahoma. The story is told in a new movie with Leonardo DiCaprio called “Killers of the Flower Moon.” If you have a chance to watch it, it's a great watch. It tells the story of how the Osage Nation of Indians were forced to leave their home in Missouri and relocate to Oklahoma. The land they were given, was thought to be worthless, but it discovered to have massive oil reserves on it; the people would soon become the wealthiest people in the world by population at the time because of the wealth the oil wells produced. The state of Oklahoma didn't deem Native Americans competent enough to handle their own finances, so they set up another structure of white guardianship. In the end, the guardians over the Native Americans were murdering the men and then marrying the women and poisoning them so that they would get their land rights for the oil wells. It was one of the first major cases of the FBI. White guardianship is a bad thing. Men should be able to determine there own future

Sarah Rector the 11-year-old that became the richest black girl in America in 1913

https://www.blackenterprise.com/sarah-rector-11-year-old-richest-black-girl/

The true story of “The Killers of the flower moon”

https://www.esquire.com/entertainment/movies/a45573176/killers-of-the-flower-moon-true-story/#

How settlers abused financial guardianship in the Osage Nation

https://www.marketplace.org/2023/11/17/how-settlers-abused-financial-guardianship-in-the-osage-nation/

Cojak

RE: Aaron comment

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24277 **4/19/24 7:41 pm**

Amen, But it seems common sense does not always prevail.....
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Carolyn Smith

Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 5910 **4/21/24 1:22 am**

It's my understanding that Black Ministries exists because it is how Black ministers wanted it when many of them came into the COG from another similar denomination.

I am part of a multicultural church that is connected to Black Ministries. There is definitely a difference in cultural experiences that would not be welcome everywhere. It is a totally acceptable and Biblical form of worship but a different experience nonetheless. I love our church and I know I'm where God wants me to be.

You might be interested to read David Roebuck's paper re: this topic here:
https://www.dixonprc.org/uploads/1/3/1/6/131606484/roebuckdavid-unraveling_cords_that_divide.pdf
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FLRon

Acts-celerater Posts: 771 **4/21/24 2:51 pm**

Thank you for providing the link to the pdf of D Roebuck’s paper Carolyn. It offers compelling evidence of the prejudice that has long existed in the church of God. That the overwhelming majority of cog members are non white and the overwhelming majority of elected leaders are white speaks to a continued effort to maintain the status quo. If the cog was truly interested in diversity, there would be a proportionate number of non white leaders in key leadership positions. However, as long as voting is limited to those who can attend the GA, very little will likely change. Is that how the majority of cog members want it?
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Cojak

01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24277 **4/21/24 3:06 pm**

Very interesting paper Carolyn.. Thanks. It was about 1925-28 that my dad came into the COG from the Fire Baptized Movement. My mama immediately became interested in the 'Colored Work' and missions. She probably raised money to build20-25 churches in the Carribean and in Africa. Being from rural Georgia she was well aware of the white/colored separation. But until she dies declared "In my house there is no difference in the colored's and whites!!
Mom and dad were both from rural Georgia and I NEVER heard the 'N' word in our house. (sorry to run on) I just wanted to say thanks...
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Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
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4thgeneration

Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1599 **4/22/24 2:07 pm**

[quote="FLRon"]"the overwhelming majority of cog members are non white and the overwhelming majority of elected leaders are white speaks to a continued effort to maintain the status quo."

I think that this statement has to ignore the fact that outside the USA there are vast regions led by large numbers of non white leaders, elected and appointed to offices on a national, regional, district and local level. To compare the macrocosm of COG membership worldwide with the microcosm of USA elected leaders on general and state levels is IMO comparing apples to oranges, and necessary to make the COG appear racially imbalanced and even prejudiced.

Just my O.

Sweethomealabama

Hey, DOC Posts: 66 **4/22/24 4:56 pm**

[quote="4thgeneration"]