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Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if...

 
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Post Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if... Link
Pastors, would you perform a gay wedding for two people who, legally, are the same sex on their legal documents now, but not on their birth certificates. One of them is trans, and they are biologically of the opposite sex. Acts-perienced Poster
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12/27/23 10:34 pm


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Post Re: Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if... Nature Boy Florida
Link wrote:
Pastors, would you perform a gay wedding for two people who, legally, are the same sex on their legal documents now, but not on their birth certificates. One of them is trans, and they are biologically of the opposite sex.



It would seem that a male and female being joined together would be biblical - but turn in your license afterwards just to be safe. Twisted Evil
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12/28/23 11:29 am


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Post FLRon
Since those involved are claiming to be gay I wouldn’t have anything to do with the ceremony.
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Post Why would these two ... Mat
Why would these two people want a Christian wedding? If their lifestyle is counter to all things Biblical when it comes to marriage, why bring God into the contractual agreement?

I don't know of a Bible believing minister of the Gospel who could really justify being part of such a travesty, or as Isaiah 5:20–21 says, "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter! Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes, and shrewd in their own sight!"

Using our calling and authority to officiate non-Biblical unions is the act of calling evil good. Blessing (which is what performing a marriage ceremony is) such a union is more in line with the idol worshippers priest then the high calling of he man of God. The fact to do so is to curse yourself and undermine Biblical marriages.

Mat
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12/29/23 8:13 am


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Post sheepdogandy
Nope, not a chance.
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12/29/23 10:45 am


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Post Old Time Country Preacher
No! Acts-pert Poster
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12/30/23 11:10 pm


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Post caseyleejones
Would you marry a couple living together? Acts-perienced Poster
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12/31/23 9:48 am


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Post Link
FLRon wrote:
Since those involved are claiming to be gay I wouldn’t have anything to do with the ceremony.


No, I put it in quotes, without much explanation. Imagine converts who had a sordid and medically messy past, who 'identify' as what they were originally. Also, suppose they had enough of whatever left to consummate the marriage.
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1/2/24 10:13 am


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Post Link
caseyleejones wrote:
Would you marry a couple living together?


I think that deserves its own thread.

I heard of a preacher, the head of a 'full gospel' denomination in Indonesia saying he personally wouldn't marry any couple that had lived under the same roof. Maybe he wanted to deter that, but that didn't make sense to me. If there are no other issues that are a problem, I'd expect shacking-up couples to marry in a lot of cases as they repent.

Issues that might get in the way:
- if one is an unbeliever.
- if one is married to someone else (or marriage and divorce issues).
- if parents, especially bride's father, oppose it.
- if they are close kin (brother and sister, parent and child, brother or sister in law where sibling is still living).
- if they are the same sex (of course).

At one church we went to, there was a shacking up couple with kids who'd just never married. My wife asked them why they didn't get married. I don't know if anyone else did. I think they were planning on it and the nudge helped. I believe the church helped with the expense and food.

At another church, I was trying to encourage a couple to marry and tried to help them get the ball rolling. They didn't speak English, so it was hard to say what all I wanted to.
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1/2/24 10:18 am


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Post Of course not BishopsWife
BUT know a Pentecostal Holiness minister who did. His excuse "he was afraid he'd lose his license to preach" Apparently, he was afraid of a lawsuit if he did not, BUT was not afraid of answering to God. I was totally shocked, especially since he was an elderly (like 76 yrs old) and not a younger minister. I still shake my hand at why the PH organization didn't take his license. Acts Enthusiast
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1/5/24 12:19 pm


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Post Re: Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if... MayB2Day
Link wrote:
Pastors, would you perform a gay wedding for two people who, legally, are the same sex on their legal documents now, but not on their birth certificates. One of them is trans, and they are biologically of the opposite sex.


No. People who think they are transgender suffer from a mental illness and I cannot be a part of a wedding ceremony where one party suffers that kind of mental illness.


Dr. Paul McHugh, of Johns Hopkins, studied transgenderism for 40 years and concluded that it is just a different form of schizophrenia. Dr McHugh says that transgenderism is a mental illness that needs to be treated not merely a preference that needs to be accommodated.
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1/22/24 12:38 pm


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Post Re: Of course not Link
BishopsWife wrote:
BUT know a Pentecostal Holiness minister who did. His excuse "he was afraid he'd lose his license to preach" Apparently, he was afraid of a lawsuit if he did not, BUT was not afraid of answering to God. I was totally shocked, especially since he was an elderly (like 76 yrs old) and not a younger minister. I still shake my hand at why the PH organization didn't take his license.


Did you report him to his bishop?

If it were two people who were originally the same gender, who'd gotten mutilated, who repented, the issue would be the ability to consummate the marriage. I would imagine preachers do not usually ask too many questions about that for normal couples.
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1/22/24 8:11 pm


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Post Re: Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if... Link
MayB2Day wrote:
Link wrote:
Pastors, would you perform a gay wedding for two people who, legally, are the same sex on their legal documents now, but not on their birth certificates. One of them is trans, and they are biologically of the opposite sex.


No. People who think they are transgender suffer from a mental illness and I cannot be a part of a wedding ceremony where one party suffers that kind of mental illness.


Dr. Paul McHugh, of Johns Hopkins, studied transgenderism for 40 years and concluded that it is just a different form of schizophrenia. Dr McHugh says that transgenderism is a mental illness that needs to be treated not merely a preference that needs to be accommodated.


What if a man was married to a woman, then he got brainwashed by the trans propaganda, had some shots or some work done to make himself look like a woman, got his gender legally changed, repented and wanted to reconcile with his wife. You don't know what parts he's got left. He repents. (Do you want to ask?) He just wants a quick ceremony with no guests. Would you consider it?

Would you marry a couple if one of them had occasional bouts with manic or schitzophrenia? What if both of them had had issues, were pushing 40, never married, longing for someone to marry, both wanted children, both their families were supported, they love each other, and had both disclosed their mental health histories to one another. Neither is trans or gay. Would you consider marrying them?
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1/23/24 12:07 pm


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Post Re: Would you perform a 'gay wedding' if... MayB2Day
Link wrote:
What if a man was married to a woman, then he got brainwashed by the trans propaganda, had some shots or some work done to make himself look like a woman, got his gender legally changed, repented and wanted to reconcile with his wife. You don't know what parts he's got left. He repents. (Do you want to ask?) He just wants a quick ceremony with no guests. Would you consider it?

Would you marry a couple if one of them had occasional bouts with manic or schitzophrenia? What if both of them had had issues, were pushing 40, never married, longing for someone to marry, both wanted children, both their families were supported, they love each other, and had both disclosed their mental health histories to one another. Neither is trans or gay. Would you consider marrying them?


Scenario #1: You are no longer talking about a trans person.


Scenario #2: Depends on what kind of behaviors their schizophrenia casused them to act out. But probably not.
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Post caviator
Statement of the Church of God Regarding Same-Sex Marriage Court Decision [dated June 26, 2015]

Adopted by the 75th International General Assembly (p. 158-159, S63) in GENERAL INSTRUCTIONS FOR MINISTERS

II. Marriage and Same-Sex Relationships


A. The Church of God rejects the cultural, political, and theological pressures to change the definition of marriage as being between one man and one woman. We affirm this definition based on God’s Word and the truth that Christian marriage between a man and a woman reflects the theological truth of Christ’s love for His Church.

B. Church of God ministers, whether an ordained minister or ordained bishop, shall only perform or participate in marriage ceremonies or marriage blessings between one man and one woman, as marriage is defined in the Bible. This policy also is applicable to Church of God ministers who serve in capacities outside the scope of normal pastoring, such as military, hospital, and corporate chaplains.

C. Local Church of God churches and the local Church of God ministers who serve them shall only hold, provide facilities for, conduct or preside over weddings, wedding receptions, and anniversaries (and other gatherings related to weddings, receptions, and anniversaries) that celebrate a marriage or blessing between one man and one woman, as marriage is defined in the Bible.

D. Church of God ministers shall maintain a Christ-like attitude of love, mercy, and grace, when counseling or otherwise dealing with individuals in same-gender relationships. A Christ-like spirit will maintain the truth of God’s Word, the policies of the church, and avoid inappropriate remarks or attitudes that do not reflect the Holy Spirit.

E. Church of God ministers shall seek to find godly counselors to whom they can refer individuals in same-gender relationships for additional ministry and guidance.

F. Failure of Church of God ministers to adhere to these biblically based guidelines will result in forfeiture of ministerial credentials.
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2/27/24 7:18 am


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Post FLRon
caviator wrote:
Statement of the Church of God Regarding Same-Sex Marriage Court Decision [dated June 26, 2015]

Adopted by the 75th International General Assembly (p. 158-159, S63) in GENERAL INSTRUCTIONS FOR MINISTERS

II. Marriage and Same-Sex Relationships


A. The Church of God rejects the cultural, political, and theological pressures to change the definition of marriage as being between one man and one woman. We affirm this definition based on God’s Word and the truth that Christian marriage between a man and a woman reflects the theological truth of Christ’s love for His Church.

B. Church of God ministers, whether an ordained minister or ordained bishop, shall only perform or participate in marriage ceremonies or marriage blessings between one man and one woman, as marriage is defined in the Bible. This policy also is applicable to Church of God ministers who serve in capacities outside the scope of normal pastoring, such as military, hospital, and corporate chaplains.

C. Local Church of God churches and the local Church of God ministers who serve them shall only hold, provide facilities for, conduct or preside over weddings, wedding receptions, and anniversaries (and other gatherings related to weddings, receptions, and anniversaries) that celebrate a marriage or blessing between one man and one woman, as marriage is defined in the Bible.

D. Church of God ministers shall maintain a Christ-like attitude of love, mercy, and grace, when counseling or otherwise dealing with individuals in same-gender relationships. A Christ-like spirit will maintain the truth of God’s Word, the policies of the church, and avoid inappropriate remarks or attitudes that do not reflect the Holy Spirit.

E. Church of God ministers shall seek to find godly counselors to whom they can refer individuals in same-gender relationships for additional ministry and guidance.

F. Failure of Church of God ministers to adhere to these biblically based guidelines will result in forfeiture of ministerial credentials.


I realize that this thread is about gay weddings, but is there a CoG edict stating that CoG facilities must not be used by a gay person for the purposes of holding a community fundraiser?
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2/27/24 2:57 pm


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Post Gay weddings ... Mat
It seems clear gay wedding, both officiating and allowing them in a COG property are anathema, and I fully support any church and minister who stands on the truth that marriage is between a man and a women.

It seems attending a guy wedding is still up for debate, though attendance is approval. Do officiants of gay wedding still ask the question, "does anyone here know of any reason why these two should not be joined together in Holy Matrimony?" It seems a minister of the Gospel would be compelled to say something, but I doubt they would ask that question.

So if attending gay weddings are OK, what other activities can we be part of? Is it OK to attend a Pro Abortion rally or a KKK meeting, or to be active in the local Masonic lodge? How about a wine tasting or a strip club?

Did Christians attend the Roman circus? I mean as spectators, not as the victims, as we know they had no choice in the matter.

Mat
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2/27/24 4:44 pm


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Post caviator
[INSERT NAME OF LOCAL CHURCH OF GOD CONGREGATION]
FACILITIES USE POLICY AND PROCEDURES

Adopted by the Church and Pastor's Council on ______________

1. Preface.

• Purposes and Beliefs. [INSERT NAME OF LOCAL CHURCH OF GOD CONGREGATION] (hereinafter the 'Church') is established for religious, educational, and charitable purposes, specifically to communicate the Gospel of Jesus Christ in the power of the Holy Spirit and to own such properties and conduct such services and activities as will be effective in accomplishing the purposes stated above.

The Church adheres to the Declaration of Faith and Practical Commitments set forth in the Church of God Book of Discipline, Church Order, and Governance (the Minutes of the General Assembly, as amended from time to time).

• Purpose of this Policy. Under the First and Fourteenth Amendments of the United States Constitution, the Church has the legal right to free exercise of religion and freedom of association. These rights permit the Church to limit the use of its property and facilities and all other property under its control, (collectively, the 'Facility') to activities, events, meetings, and other uses that advance, directly or indirectly, its religious purposes, mission, and beliefs. If the use of the Facility conveys a message that is inconsistent with the Church's purposes and beliefs, it would be a violation of the Church's religious practices and faith. The Church must convey a consistent message as part of its witness to the Gospel of Jesus Christ and must avoid the confusion that would be created by use that is contrary to the beliefs or practices of the Church.

The purpose of this policy is to ensure that all use of the Church's property and facilities is for activities that further its religious purposes, mission, and statement of faith, as discerned and directed by the Church and Pastor's Council. The Church sees its property as holy and set apart to worship God.


2. Authority and Approval.

• Content of Policy. This Facility Use Policy and Procedures (the 'Policy') contains details regarding the individuals and groups permitted to use the Facility, the priority of use, the permissible uses of the Facility, a schedule of fees, the procedure for applying to use the Facility, and requirements and guidelines for using different parts of the Facility.

• Authorization of Officer. The Pastor is authorized by the Church and Pastor's Council to ensure that all uses of the Facility advance the purposes of the Church and are consistent with the requirements of this Policy.

• Amendment. Amendments to this Policy must be approved by the Church and Pastor's Council and must be consistent with the Church of God Book of Discipline, Church Order, and Governance (the Minutes of the General Assembly, as amended from time to time).


3. Use of Facility in Furtherance of the Church's Religious Purposes.

3.1 Permitted Uses. The Church's facilities are not open to the general public. In furtherance of its religious purposes and mission, the Church makes its facilities available to it ministries and members, and to churches and other religious organizations (1) with beliefs and practices that are consistent with orthodox, Biblical Christianity and not inconsistent with the Practical Commitments, and (2) that utilize the Church's facilities to advance the Gospel of Jesus Christ. In addition, non-religious, tax-exempt charitable, educational, and civic groups engaged in nonprofit activities that promote the flourishing and common good of society in a manner that is consistent with Biblical principles and not inconsistent with the Practical Commitments may be eligible to use the Church's facilities where such use allows the Church to demonstrate the Gospel and Biblical principles through its hospitality and service, subject to the other sections of this policy.

3.2 Impermissible Uses. The Church's facilities may not be used by groups holding or advocating beliefs or practices that conflict with the Church's religious purposes or the Practical Commitments. Nor may its facilities be used to engage in or promote activities that are inconsistent with the moral and ethical teachings of the Bible. Without limitation, the following beliefs, practices and activities are inconsistent with the religious purposes of the Church, and thus groups that hold, advocate or engage in such beliefs or practices are ineligible to use the Church's facilities:

• Any religious or philosophical belief, teaching or practice, or promotion of a worldview, that is inconsistent with orthodox, Biblical Christianity.
• Practice or advocacy of sexual conduct outside the covenant of marriage between one man and one woman.
• Practice or advocacy of activities that violate treatment of all human life (born or unborn) as sacred, created in the image of God.
• Advocacy of gambling, or the use of alcohol or controlled substances.

3.3 Determination of Eligibility. The Pastor is responsible to determine whether a group is eligible to use the Church's facilities in accordance with this Policy, and shall confer with the Church and Pastor's Council in instances where he deems further input is warranted.

3.4 Priority of Use. Use of the Church's facilities is to be granted in the following order or priority:
• Members of the Church, their immediate families, and organized groups that are part of the ministry of the Church
• Non-members in the following priority:
o Churches and religious tax-exempt organizations that adhere to the Declaration of Faith and Practical Commitments
o Churches and religious tax-exempt organizations with beliefs and practices that are consistent with orthodox, Biblical Christianity and not inconsistent with the Practical Commitments
o Individuals and non-religious tax-exempt charitable, educational, and civic groups engaged in nonprofit activities that promote the flourishing and common good of society in a manner that is consistent with Biblical principles and not inconsistent with the Practical Commitments


4. Application and Scheduling Procedures. Application to use the Facility may be made to ___________ by submitting the individual or organization name, contact person, contact information, requested use for the facility, dates of use, and any background information on the organization requesting use (mission, vision, website, etc.). The Church will begin its screening process upon application and respond within ______ days as to whether the Facility is available and whether the use is consistent with the requirements of this Policy


5. Fee Schedule. Upon approval of application for use of Facility, a ____ security deposit is due. A certificate of insurance for at least _____________ of coverage must be provided. Other fees for use are as follows: [Insert Fee Schedule]


6. Facility Use Regulations. All individuals and organizations that use the Facility shall follow the following regulations, a copy of which shall be provided to each user:
• The Facility may not be used to engage in or promote activities that are inconsistent with the Declaration of Faith and Practical Commitments set forth in the Church of God Book of Discipline, Church Order, and Governance (the Minutes of the General Assembly, as amended from time to time), or the moral and ethical teachings of the Bible.
• Alcohol, gambling, smoking, and drug use are not permitted anywhere in the Facility or on Church property.
• Organizations and individuals using the Facility are restricted to the areas reserved and approved for use.
• Church equipment may only be used with express permission. Equipment must be returned to the place it was found when arriving at the Facility on the date of use.
• All individuals and/or organizations that use the Facility shall sign the acknowledgement and affirmation attached as Exhibit A to this Policy.

EXHIBIT A
[INSERT NAME OF LOCAL CHURCH OF GOD CONGREGATION]
AFFIRMATION AND ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF FACILITY USE REGULATIONS

User of the Facility acknowledges that it has read and understood the Church's Facility Regulations. User of the Facility affirms that it will abide by the Church's Facility Use Regulations during its use of the Facility on ________________.

User of the Facility understands that it will be responsible for any damages to the Facility resulting from the use. Any disputes between the Church and User of the Facility shall be submitted to Christian mediation for resolution.


Name of Organization, Group, or Individual User: _____________________________

Signature: _______________________________
Print Name: _______________________________
Date: _______________________________
Hey, DOC
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2/28/24 1:44 pm


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Post FLRon
Thank you for posting this. It seems clear that a gay or lesbian person is not permitted to use CoG facilities. I’ll be bringing this to the attention of a local pastor.
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