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Should members keep giving money to a church that refuses to disclose how the money is spent? |
FLRon |
In the spirit of the other thread about churches that don’t disclose the pastor’s salary, I thought I’d start a similar thread about churches that fail to disclose how the money is actually spent.
So, would you continue to support a church with tithes and offerings if the church doesn’t have a meeting where the financial report is presented?
Or would you say that you’re giving to the Lord and let it go? _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/7/18 9:20 pm
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Re: Should members keep giving money to a church that refuses to disclose how the money is spent? |
THE LOVE OF GOD |
FLRon wrote: | In the spirit of the other thread about churches that don’t disclose the pastor’s salary, I thought I’d start a similar thread about churches that fail to disclose how the money is actually spent.
So, would you continue to support a church with tithes and offerings if the church doesn’t have a meeting where the financial report is presented?
Or would you say that you’re giving to the Lord and let it go? |
My husband always gave a financial report every August on the amount the church took in each month and how each dollar was spent. He always told the people who were members and tithe payers that at any time they could request to see the financial report and the clerk would let them see the books - even the report on each tithe payer. In all our years of pastoring only one person ask to see the record of another tithe payer. He was jealous of the other person and wanted to make sure he was a tithe payer (which he was).
He thought it was the standard or law of the land that a financial report was to be given each year. He would give a vocal report and also lay all the church records on the altar (check book, tithe records and all) and no one ever came to the altar to look at it. He encouraged questions about the report as he went by each monthly income and expenditure page. He said nothing is done in secret in the COG. |
Friendly Face Posts: 387 7/8/18 1:01 am
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Re: Should members keep giving money to a church that refuses to disclose how the money is spent? |
FLRon |
THE LOVE OF GOD wrote: | FLRon wrote: | In the spirit of the other thread about churches that don’t disclose the pastor’s salary, I thought I’d start a similar thread about churches that fail to disclose how the money is actually spent.
So, would you continue to support a church with tithes and offerings if the church doesn’t have a meeting where the financial report is presented?
Or would you say that you’re giving to the Lord and let it go? |
My husband always gave a financial report every August on the amount the church took in each month and how each dollar was spent. He always told the people who were members and tithe payers that at any time they could request to see the financial report and the clerk would let them see the books - even the report on each tithe payer. In all our years of pastoring only one person ask to see the record of another tithe payer. He was jealous of the other person and wanted to make sure he was a tithe payer (which he was).
He thought it was the standard or law of the land that a financial report was to be given each year. He would give a vocal report and also lay all the church records on the altar (check book, tithe records and all) and no one ever came to the altar to look at it. He encouraged questions about the report as he went by each monthly income and expenditure page. He said nothing is done in secret in the COG. |
Your husband sounds like a very wise man. Thank you. _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/8/18 8:41 am
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sheepdogandy |
We post a quarterly itemized financial report on the bulletin board for all to see.
Also, a copy of the report is handed out at every quarterly Church Conference meeting.
Every penny is accounted for.
Every expenditure is accounted for.
Yes, all of my salary and benefits are listed for everyone to see.
It's the only way to do the Church's business. _________________ Charles A. Hutchins
Senior Pastor SPWC
Congregational Church of God
www.spwc.church |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 7305 7/8/18 9:03 am
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Judah4Him |
What's your Sunday attendance?
It's not the only way. Very few churches do it that way, actually. |
Friendly Face Posts: 468 7/8/18 9:16 am
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Quiet Wyatt |
We give a complete accounting of all our financials to our church at our annual business meeting. We give a complete monthly accounting to our Finance Committee. All our financial reports are also made available upon request to anyone who is interested. All our business meetings are likewise open to all who may be interested. People who are not tithe-paying members in good standing are asked to respect the business meeting by not commenting during the meeting, but anyone can sit in on a meeting and listen if they wish.
I often say that we don’t do anything in secret with the money that comes into the church, and I absolutely mean that. I see absolutely no good reason to not be completely open with our financial reports. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12813 7/8/18 9:20 am
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FLRon |
Quiet Wyatt wrote: | We give a complete accounting of all our financials to our church at our annual business meeting. We give a complete monthly accounting to our Finance Committee. All our financial reports are also made available upon request to anyone who is interested. All our business meetings are likewise open to all who may be interested. People who are not tithe-paying members in good standing are asked to respect the business meeting by not commenting during the meeting, but anyone can sit in on a meeting and listen if they wish.
I often say that we don’t do anything in secret with the money that comes into the church, and I absolutely mean that. I see absolutely no good reason to not be completely open with our financial reports. |
Thank you, but what would you do if the church you attended was not as open as yours is? Do you turn the other cheek,so to speak,and act like it doesn’t bother you? _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/8/18 5:14 pm
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FLRon |
sheepdogandy wrote: | We post a quarterly itemized financial report on the bulletin board for all to see.
Also, a copy of the report is handed out at every quarterly Church Conference meeting.
Every penny is accounted for.
Every expenditure is accounted for.
Yes, all of my salary and benefits are listed for everyone to see.
It's the only way to do the Church's business. |
That’s how I feel it should be done as well. When I pastored I was very careful not to give any indication of improprieties, and everyone knew if they had a question or concern about the finances all they had to do was ask and I would show them the details. _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/8/18 5:20 pm
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THE LOVE OF GOD |
sheepdogandy wrote: | We post a quarterly itemized financial report on the bulletin board for all to see.
Also, a copy of the report is handed out at every quarterly Church Conference meeting.
Every penny is accounted for.
Every expenditure is accounted for.
Yes, all of my salary and benefits are listed for everyone to see.
It's the only way to do the Church's business. |
I agree. If members are told up front, then the devil can't accuse the church of doing wrong concerning the finances. |
Friendly Face Posts: 387 7/8/18 8:30 pm
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Cojak |
THE LOVE OF GOD wrote: | sheepdogandy wrote: | We post a quarterly itemized financial report on the bulletin board for all to see.
Also, a copy of the report is handed out at every quarterly Church Conference meeting.
Every penny is accounted for.
Every expenditure is accounted for.
Yes, all of my salary and benefits are listed for everyone to see.
It's the only way to do the Church's business. |
I agree. If members are told up front, then the devil can't accuse the church of doing wrong concerning the finances. |
_________________ Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24283 7/8/18 10:52 pm
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Cojak |
I don't think our church is quite as open as SD, QW or TLofG says but I am not around enough to know. BUT I appreciate those who give complete accountability transparent. It is safer and right for the tithe payers and supporters of the church.
I love, respect and trust our present pastor, but would be surprised if a complete 'detailed' financial statement was made outside the 'men's council'. I do not want to be on the council so I guess I will never know. lol
I was an old man before I realized how secretive our COG administrative branch is. _________________ Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24283 7/8/18 10:58 pm
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Quiet Wyatt |
FLRon wrote: | Quiet Wyatt wrote: | We give a complete accounting of all our financials to our church at our annual business meeting. We give a complete monthly accounting to our Finance Committee. All our financial reports are also made available upon request to anyone who is interested. All our business meetings are likewise open to all who may be interested. People who are not tithe-paying members in good standing are asked to respect the business meeting by not commenting during the meeting, but anyone can sit in on a meeting and listen if they wish.
I often say that we don’t do anything in secret with the money that comes into the church, and I absolutely mean that. I see absolutely no good reason to not be completely open with our financial reports. |
Thank you, but what would you do if the church you attended was not as open as yours is? Do you turn the other cheek,so to speak,and act like it doesn’t bother you? |
If it bothered me, I suppose I would try and talk with the pastor about it. I would do it with a very laid back, non-accusatory tone, emphasizing how much I love the church and the pastor, etc., and while I don’t have any reason to doubt the integrity of the church’s finances, since I have committed to the church as a supporting member, and give my tithes and offerings faithfully, I would just like to know where my tithes and offerings are being spent, etc.
If the pastor was not open to sharing that information, I might kindly ask why it is a secret, and what level of commitment would be necessary in order to become privileged to know what my tithes and offerings were being used for.
If that didn’t work, I suppose I’d have to consider possibly finding another church. Or, if I still really loved the church and its pastor, I would pray about possibly staying regardless. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12813 7/9/18 12:13 am
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Carolyn Smith |
I thought giving a financial report quarterly was a requirement of the COG minutes or bylaws or something. The COGs I have been a part of as an adult have usually presented this material freely in business meetings.
Is it a requirement of the minutes?
It's not in the bylaws; I just looked. _________________ "More of Him...less of me."
http://twitter.com/camiracle77
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name |
Hon. Dr. in Acts-celeratology Posts: 5921 7/9/18 6:16 am
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FLRon |
Quiet Wyatt wrote: | FLRon wrote: | Quiet Wyatt wrote: | We give a complete accounting of all our financials to our church at our annual business meeting. We give a complete monthly accounting to our Finance Committee. All our financial reports are also made available upon request to anyone who is interested. All our business meetings are likewise open to all who may be interested. People who are not tithe-paying members in good standing are asked to respect the business meeting by not commenting during the meeting, but anyone can sit in on a meeting and listen if they wish.
I often say that we don’t do anything in secret with the money that comes into the church, and I absolutely mean that. I see absolutely no good reason to not be completely open with our financial reports. |
Thank you, but what would you do if the church you attended was not as open as yours is? Do you turn the other cheek,so to speak,and act like it doesn’t bother you? |
If it bothered me, I suppose I would try and talk with the pastor about it. I would do it with a very laid back, non-accusatory tone, emphasizing how much I love the church and the pastor, etc., and while I don’t have any reason to doubt the integrity of the church’s finances, since I have committed to the church as a supporting member, and give my tithes and offerings faithfully, I would just like to know where my tithes and offerings are being spent, etc.
If the pastor was not open to sharing that information, I might kindly ask why it is a secret, and what level of commitment would be necessary in order to become privileged to know what my tithes and offerings were being used for.
If that didn’t work, I suppose I’d have to consider possibly finding another church. Or, if I still really loved the church and its pastor, I would pray about possibly staying regardless. |
Lot of wisdom in what you say. _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/9/18 8:48 pm
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FLRon |
Carolyn Smith wrote: | I thought giving a financial report quarterly was a requirement of the COG minutes or bylaws or something. The COGs I have been a part of as an adult have usually presented this material freely in business meetings.
Is it a requirement of the minutes?
It's not in the bylaws; I just looked. |
Many,many moons ago when I was a church clerk I had to put those quarterly reports together Carolyn. Apparently that is no longer a requirement? _________________ “Hell will be filled with people that didn’t cuss, didn’t drink, and may even have been baptized. Why? Because none of those things makes someone a Christian.”
Voddie Baucham |
Acts-celerater Posts: 782 7/9/18 8:51 pm
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Cojak |
ost of the financial statements I have seen lump salaries and church expenses together. Giving an over-all view with All income and all outlay with some 'extra' items specified. I do not think I have ever seen a detailed report.
One comment mentioned a tithe payer being able to see individual tithe payers records, I do not like that. I feel I am responsible to give and know how it is spent, but it is none of my business what someone else gives. Just my opinion! _________________ Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24283 7/9/18 9:49 pm
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Quiet Wyatt |
Our financial reports don’t lump any salaries together. That is how I believe it should be. |
[Insert Acts Pun Here] Posts: 12813 7/9/18 10:00 pm
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Cojak |
Quiet Wyatt wrote: | Our financial reports don’t lump any salaries together. That is how I believe it should be. |
Agree! _________________ Some facts but mostly just my opinion!
jacsher@aol.com
http://shipslog-jack.blogspot.com/ |
01000001 01100011 01110100 01110011 Posts: 24283 7/9/18 10:08 pm
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