|
Actscelerate.com Open Any Time -- Day or Night
|
View previous topic :: View next topic |
Message |
Author |
|
Da Sheik |
Mat, I agree with the heart of your post. I just do not see foot washing as an ordinance. I don’t think it was ceremonial in nature. It was practical. Taught them (and us) a very powerful lesson on humility and servanthood. We don’t live in culture where we travel on foot and have dirty sandals. So when we observe foot washing, it is purely ceremonial. Some may disagree, but I believe it is possible to participate in a foot washing ceremony, and still have a heart full of pride!
The Pharisees were living proof. They fasted. They prayed. They tithed. But their hearts were far from God.
Appreciate the tone of the discussion here. |
Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1860 4/20/18 10:12 am
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Nature Boy Florida |
And Shiek - I disagree with your assessment.
Jesus didn't wash feet when guests arrived at the home - he did it DURING the meal. Totally unnecessary to physically cleanse someone at that point.
He didn't baptize folks because they needed a bath either - even though cleansing oneself in a river did occur back them - and not so much today.
Humility is a nice Christian trait - but there were better ways then and now to accomplish that.
The cleansing part - much like what takes place with baptism - was what he was teaching - but the washing of regeneration does not need to take place again - only the things that still "accumulate" on the Christian.
And it's apparently an act that we help others accomplish. _________________ Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 4/20/18 10:22 am
|
|
| |
|
|
Da Sheik |
Nature Boy Florida wrote: | Jesus didn't wash feet when guests arrived at the home - he did it DURING the meal. Totally unnecessary to physically cleanse someone at that point. |
I agree that it was a definite, intentional teaching moment.
Nature Boy Florida wrote: | He didn't baptize folks because they needed a bath either - even though cleansing oneself in a river did occur back them - and not so much today.
Humility is a nice Christian trait - but there were better ways then and now to accomplish that.
The cleansing part - much like what takes place with baptism - was what he was teaching - but the washing of regeneration does not need to take place again - only the things that still "accumulate" on the Christian.
And it's apparently an act that we help others accomplish. |
Baptism has plenty of support for ongoing observance. To equate the washing of feet with baptism is a gigantic exegetical leap. One that neither I, nor most of the body of Christ is willing to take. Not because we are too good to get down and wash someone's feet. But because there is no scriptural support for making it an ordinance.
Consider this. Besides this isolated incident where Jesus washed the disciples' feet, the only other reference I am aware of is in I Timothy 5:9-10 where Paul is giving instructions on how to financially care for the widows. One of the qualifications was that she "washed" the saints feet. If this were something done on an ordinary basis as a ceremony, there would be no need to even list this. And in this mention, you can see that clearly the issue is hospitality and not ceremony. |
Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1860 4/20/18 12:03 pm
|
|
| |
|
|
Old Time Country Preacher |
Da Sheik wrote: | a gigantic exegetical leap. |
My gootness, Sheik, at is one more kinda leap. The ole timer has leaped a few times in his life, but I don't ever remember "a gigantic exegetical leap." At sounds like one a them kinds a leaps the woffies take with 3 John 2. Them boys git to leapin all over at verse till they say it means every Christian is sposed to be rich and walk in divine health.
But to the issue at hand, we do know this, the early church, in particular the Johannine community, observed foot-washing as a means of addressing post-baptismal sins. |
Acts-pert Poster Posts: 15565 4/20/18 12:51 pm
|
|
| |
|
|
Mat |
Old Time Country Preacher wrote: | Da Sheik wrote: | a gigantic exegetical leap. |
My gootness, Sheik, at is one more kinda leap. The ole timer has leaped a few times in his life, but I don't ever remember "a gigantic exegetical leap." At sounds like one a them kinds a leaps the woffies take with 3 John 2. Them boys git to leapin all over at verse till they say it means every Christian is sposed to be rich and walk in divine health.
But to the issue at hand, we do know this, the early church, in particular the Johannine community, observed foot-washing as a means of addressing post-baptismal sins. |
OTCP, what source are you sighting on you last statement - is it scripture or other writings. Not casting doubt, just would like to know.
Mat |
Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1979 4/20/18 1:41 pm
|
|
| |
|
|
Da Sheik |
Old Time Country Preacher wrote: |
But to the issue at hand, we do know this, the early church, in particular the Johannine community, observed foot-washing as a means of addressing post-baptismal sins. |
This may be true (honestly, I've never researched the history of the practice outside of the bible), but still doesn't carry with it the weight of "ordinance" in my opinion.
Having said that, I have no personal aversion to foot washing. My appeal comes from the wording and definition of "ordinance". |
Acts Enthusiast Posts: 1860 4/23/18 1:27 pm
|
|
| |
|
|
Nature Boy Florida |
Da Sheik wrote: | Nature Boy Florida wrote: | Jesus didn't wash feet when guests arrived at the home - he did it DURING the meal. Totally unnecessary to physically cleanse someone at that point. |
I agree that it was a definite, intentional teaching moment.
Nature Boy Florida wrote: | He didn't baptize folks because they needed a bath either - even though cleansing oneself in a river did occur back them - and not so much today.
Humility is a nice Christian trait - but there were better ways then and now to accomplish that.
The cleansing part - much like what takes place with baptism - was what he was teaching - but the washing of regeneration does not need to take place again - only the things that still "accumulate" on the Christian.
And it's apparently an act that we help others accomplish. |
Baptism has plenty of support for ongoing observance. To equate the washing of feet with baptism is a gigantic exegetical leap. One that neither I, nor most of the body of Christ is willing to take. Not because we are too good to get down and wash someone's feet. But because there is no scriptural support for making it an ordinance.
Consider this. Besides this isolated incident where Jesus washed the disciples' feet, the only other reference I am aware of is in I Timothy 5:9-10 where Paul is giving instructions on how to financially care for the widows. One of the qualifications was that she "washed" the saints feet. If this were something done on an ordinary basis as a ceremony, there would be no need to even list this. And in this mention, you can see that clearly the issue is hospitality and not ceremony. |
I don't equate it with baptism...which is a one time thing...like salvation.
Foot washing was designed to be done on an ongoing basis. _________________ Whether you like it or not, learn to love it, because its the best thing going today! |
Acts-pert Poster Posts: 16619 4/23/18 1:40 pm
|
|
| |
|
|
|