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Where are the dead?
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Post Bro Bob
The one verse that stands out is one verse that is mis-quoted EVERY TIME you hear it.

The Bible does NOT say, "To be absent from the body IS TO BE present with the Lord."

It almost says that. And we help it along by constantly making it say that.

Reckon why we do that when we are such sticklers for precision on other things?

My wife would say, "It is better to be absent from UAB burn/trauma ICU, and to be present on River Road in Southside." But being absent from ICU does not mean you are here.

What it actually says is that it is better to be absent from the body, AND to be present with the Lord.

There is a sequence, but there is no mention of a duration.

.......................

I have a suspicion, and that is all it is. And you might not like or agree with my suspicion, but you ought to at least have the integrity to properly quote the verse that anchors your position.

My suspicion is that the truth is actually both seemingly opposing views.

The reason I suspect it is because the next life is eternal. That means time has no meaning at all. For us, time is not only sequence of events, but length and duration.

Several years ago I was anesthetized for a minor procedure. When I awoke, I knew I was in a different room from where I had been last. My wife was seated where the door had been.

I asked her, "Are they done already?"

She said with an annoyed voice, " Yes!"

I paused then asked, "Well did they find anything?"

She said, "Bob, that is the third time you have asked me this question."

Time had continued unabated for her for about an hour. For me, it could have been two minutes or 10 weeks, I would not have discerned the difference.

.....................................

Could it be that those who have fallen asleep will all awaken at the same time and for each of them it will seem as if they had only taken a short nap?

From Adam to Bob Hodo about 6000 years went by. He missed most of them, and I missed almost all of them. But I am not fussing about not getting to live through all those years. And with the way the world is going today, if I take a short nap and awaken to rise from the grave in a fresh perfect body and the apostle Paul awakens at that same instant, I am guessing we will both be pretty tickled that it was not in this life only that we had hope in Jesus Christ, our savior.

In fact, if Jesus was not who he claimed to be, and if he does not return as he said he would, then I am just as certain as Paul that Heaven will never be my address.

And for Paul and I, the length of the nap will seem like nothing.

For us both, the first moment after resurrection will seem like it was after the briefest of naps. Even though he will have been "asleep" (same condition Christ declared of Lazarus in John 11) almost 2000 years longer than me. We could both truthfully declare, that we were first absent from the body, and then next, present with the Lord.

I wish he would come today. There's some folks I want to see after they rise from their graves.
Golf Cart Mafia Underboss
Posts: 3860
5/22/15 6:24 pm


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Post Ventureforth
Eddie Robbins wrote:
No where. That's why the verse makes no sense in light of the other verses.


Does the ESV lend anything to your question?

Quote:
Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord. 2 Corinthians 5:8


I think the underlined is also consistent with the Greek.

We will continue to be with the Lord, but then we will be "at home" with the Lord. It can be said that this current world is not our home. Just a thought.

But as far as Philippians 1:23, I would agree with Bro Bob that departing and being with Christ doesn't necessarily give a time frame, it seems to me.
Quote:
I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better.


It is an interesting line of thought to contemplate what it means to be "with the Lord."
If we went to paradise, would we be considered to be "with the Lord?"
Was Adam "with the Lord" in the garden before the fall?
Acts-celerater
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5/24/15 11:08 pm


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Post Nature Boy Florida
Bro Bob wrote:
The one verse that stands out is one verse that is mis-quoted EVERY TIME you hear it.

The Bible does NOT say, "To be absent from the body IS TO BE present with the Lord."
...
What it actually says is that it is better to be absent from the body, AND to be present with the Lord.


You seem to be parsing the word AND mighty heavily.

AND often does not mean ANY time lapse between the two joined phrases.

Either interpretation could be deemed correct. Not sure either side should be dogmatic about it.

When you sit down to eat chicken AND dumplings - do you get the chicken for an appetizer and wait 30 minutes for the dumplings to arrive?
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5/26/15 8:22 am


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